Freethought & Rationalism Archive

RowleyBirkinQC · 01-12-2003, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by elwoodblues
Anyone know if Shaq speaks ANY second language?

Er... Does Ebonics count?

DarthMom · 01-12-2003, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by August Spies
Darthmom:

personally I don't think you could have picked a worse example of a women joke than a spousal abuse one.

i intentionally picked the most tasteless one i could think of

Acinom · 01-12-2003, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Robert G. Ingersoll
And here's a woman/religion joke:

Q. Why did god create women?

A. Because sheep can't cook.

These are jokes. No one would get upset about them except assholes.

That's a bit severe for an assessment. I can think of plenty women who would be upset, or at least slightly perturbed by that joke.

IMHO though, I have to agree with whoever said that it depends on the speaker - someone saying that joke in jest is completely different from someone who has a misogynistic past saying the same thing.

clark · 01-12-2003, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Acinom
That's a bit severe for an assessment. I can think of plenty women who would be upset, or at least slightly perturbed by that joke.

IMHO though, I have to agree with whoever said that it depends on the speaker - someone saying that joke in jest is completely different from someone who has a misogynistic past saying the same thing.

I think context and intent are most important. I enjoy "off-color" and "ethnic" humor. Living in Vegas, I go to comedy clubs frequently and expect it. I saw D. L. Hughley perform a few years ago, and he made a lot of fun of white people. It was funny, in the proper context and not done with intent of malice. As a white guy, I was not offended at all.

THOUGHTfully Yours,
Clark

Sakpo · 01-12-2003, 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by clark
Shaq's comments don't fit the second definition of "racism" either. To an Chinese speaker, English sounds a bit like gibberish, and vice versa. Linguistically, the two languages are very different. Shaq was not being prejudiced, but simply making a pretty unfunny joke. More importantly, there was no malice in his comments, at least not according to the reports I have read.

THOUGHTfully Yours,
Clark

No. When idiots make "jokes" like "tell Yao Ming, 'ching-chong-yang-wah-ah-soh" they are playing on multiple stereotypes and prejudices involving Asians and Asian Americans being mysterious, comical (and less human in that way), inherently foreign, etc. Speaking in mock Chinese is a common way non Asian kids make fun of and ostracize Asian American children on the playground. Yao is from China and all that, but Shaq was playing into a much larger set of racial prejudices targeting Asians and Asian Americans alike.

Barney Gumble · 01-12-2003, 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by clark
As a white guy, I was not offended at all.

THOUGHTfully Yours,
Clark [/B]

I'm usually not offended by white stereotypes made by minorities in a joking manner either.

Then again, as a "white guy", I find I'm really not subjected to racism on a daily basis, or at least racism that affects my ability to be socially accepted and earn a decent education and living standard.

One of the perks of being a member of the majority is that harmless racial jokes usually end up being that - harmless, as the people who would take them as serious character judgments aren't usually in a position to affect my life.

Monkeybot · 01-12-2003, 09:29 PM

No doubt about it, Shaq made a really, really head-up-ass comment, and he 100% deserved to get called out for it. I actually think ethnic humour can be funny -- assuming it is done right, and done respectfully. (Dave Barry's Dave Barry Does Japan is a great example of ethnic humour done right, IMO.) Shaq's attempt at a joke, on the other hand, was totally puerile and based on stupid stereotypes; I know Shaq isn't exactly Einstein, but you'd think a grown man would be beyond the sort of idiocy espoused in that comment.

Just to keep everyone abreast of the situation: O'Neal Issues Apology (this is an LA Times article, free registration if you want to read the article):

Quote:

"To say I'm a racist against Asians is crazy," O'Neal said. "It's probably [someone] just trying to start trouble.... I'm an idiot prankster.

"I said a joke. It was a 70-30 joke. Seventy percent of people thought it was funny, 30 didn't.

That's a disturbing notion...

Quote:

"At times I try to be a comedian. Sometimes I say good jokes, sometimes I say bad jokes. If I hurt anybody's feelings, I apologize."

...

Before the Rockets played in Atlanta on Friday night, Yao said, "I believe Shaquille O'Neal was joking with what he said, but I think a lot of Asian people don't understand this kind of joke.

"I think there are a lot of difficulties in two different cultures understanding each other, especially countries of very large populations, China and the United States. The world is getting smaller and has a greater understanding of cultures."

As for O'Neal's run at the language: "Even when I was little I took a long time to learn Chinese."

...

After Friday's game, O'Neal sat in front of his locker, a small tape recorder to his right ear.

"Toy-inchee," he said, then rewound the tape. "Toy-inchee."

He looked up.

"Chinese," he said, "for 'I'm sorry.' For when I see Yao Ming."

Buddrow_Wilson · 01-12-2003, 09:59 PM

I don't think what 'shaq' said was done as a joke. He was upset that Yao Ming is getting more all-star votes than him, and so, saying that in anger is not joking, its an aggressive act manifesting in prejudicial 'joking'. I would say that he indeed is most likely racist, but I would also wonder why do we even care what this guy says? I like sports in general, but why does it matter what they think? they aren't paid to think. Our culture is rediculously obsessed with the personal lives of them and other celebrity types for that matter. I realize that people, children especially, consider people like him a rolemodel, but if we didn't splash crap like this all over the media, they would never be impressioned by it.

Praise Be To The EAC

tommyc · 01-13-2003, 06:52 AM

hmmm, is it funny to take the piss out of George bush for his southern accent then? ("dubya" anyone?) I've never heard any humour like that on these boards before.......

Buddrow_Wilson · 01-13-2003, 04:39 PM

Quote:

hmmm, is it funny to take the piss out of George bush for his southern accent then? ("dubya" anyone?) I've never heard any humour like that on these boards before.......

So...are you for or against racial/ethnic jokes? I'm not sure what we should take from that.

Bush isn't made fun of because he is southern, its because he's an ignorant, superstitious moron who happens to be southern.

Praise Be To The EAC

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01-12-2003, 09:59 PM	#28
Buddrow_Wilson Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Arkansas Posts: 1,589	I don't think what 'shaq' said was done as a joke. He was upset that Yao Ming is getting more all-star votes than him, and so, saying that in anger is not joking, its an aggressive act manifesting in prejudicial 'joking'. I would say that he indeed is most likely racist, but I would also wonder why do we even care what this guy says? I like sports in general, but why does it matter what they think? they aren't paid to think. Our culture is rediculously obsessed with the personal lives of them and other celebrity types for that matter. I realize that people, children especially, consider people like him a rolemodel, but if we didn't splash crap like this all over the media, they would never be impressioned by it. Praise Be To The EAC

01-13-2003, 06:52 AM	#29
tommyc Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: London, England Posts: 1,206	hmmm, is it funny to take the piss out of George bush for his southern accent then? ("dubya" anyone?) I've never heard any humour like that on these boards before.......

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