Amos

Good point and I sympathise with your fellow countrymen. In fact, I would take it one step further then that but that may not be allowed in your constitution.

[ March 16, 2002: Message edited by: Amos ]</p>

FarSeeker

That is not an answer; that is an evasion. But the answer is Peter Singer. People are just animals, altho ones with big brains. Nature is your "almighty creator" thus "red in tooth and claw" is allowable.

But here is your problem, you believe Hitler. Atheists believe Hitler. Need I expound on the implications of this. All the quotes Atheists give regarding Hitler are from his book or his speeches: political propaganda. Why do you accept Hitler's words lpetrich?

Which means they were Atheists who thought their own reasoning could allow them to establish a reasonable morality.

quote:
FarSeeker:
What is a Christian? Read the Books. Jesus said if someone rejects God or Him, shake the dust of their town of your sandals and leave them to God's judgment. This is explained in at least two different ways in the Gospels. ...
Can't be misquoted, but then niether is it's meaning clear. Clarification please.

[ March 31, 2002: Message edited by: FarSeeker ]</p>

hinduwoman

Now you have really stirred my curiosity ...

brahma

Can you go into the details of who says the hindu religion is practical? I doubt that the shudra with his back bent from centuries of abuse by the brahman would acquiesce with the practicality of hinduism.

Dr Theo

In response to the tone of several comments here about the relative value of Hinduism as opposed to the Christian God, I would ask if any Hindu Gods are known to personally perpetrate acts of terrorism. On that point, you are all invited to join in the discussion in my forum here "Jehovah and the War on Terrorism" -- the link below takes you there:

<a href="http://iidb.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=45&t=000278" target="_blank">http://iidb.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=45&t=000278</a>

Sincerely,
John Norman

hinduwoman

In the first place critics seem to consistently forget that only 1/5th are twiceborn. The rest of shudra population themselves are divided into several classes. There had always been thousands of poor Brahmins who were dependant on the generosity of shudra disciples and landowners. In every region it is the landowning and economically stronger caste that is dominant -- which may or may not coincide with ritual status.

Brhama how could you have lived in India and not realize that many Shudras are perfectly comfortable with their status and do not even worry about Brahmanical superiority, unless it affects their immediate comfort?

The term you should have used is untouchable.

Amos

Hinduwoman, I suspect that even the untouchables are happy with life and do not commit suicide, or at least, suicide is less common there than in the upper classes, or, let's say in America. Is this a fair assumption?

FarSeeker

Wow, let's just blame the victims here. It's quick, easy, and you don't have to prove a thing! Just include some anecdotal (of the type you would never accept yourself) and leave it at that.

Gee, what a winning (or is that whining) formula.

brahma

Sorry, my fault...

Can you go into the details of who says the hindu religion is practical? I doubt that the untouchable with his back bent from centuries of abuse by the brahman would acquiesce with the practicality of hinduism.

I missed this little titbit in your earlier post. This is the most ridiculous statement I have heard in a long time. Do you have any evidence of christian missionaries supporting armed insurgents? This is pure unadultrated drivel. You are just venting. Lets stick to reality.

[ March 31, 2002: Message edited by: brahma ]</p>

hinduwoman

I say hinduism is practical. It worked for hindus for centuries and enabled them to build a civilization and survive invasions. As I stress, the untouchables certainly object to such practicality and many who have been oppressed in the name of relgion, but that moves into the domain of individual freedom and morality, not survival of hindu society as a whole.

what I do not understand is disbelief that christian missionaries can meddle in politics. this one sample that is immediately on hand:
From The Telegraph
TRIPURA REBELS BAN KIRTAN INSTRUMENTS
Agartala, April 1 (2001): After lying low for sometime, NLFT militants have started interfering in the traditional religious rites of The Church-backed militants have banned the use of traditional musical instruments for performing kirtans (devotional songs) by Hindu tribals. In pamphlets distributed among the Hindu tribals, NLFT marauders warned against the use of traditional musical instruments.

The fiat has triggered panic among the Hindu tribals living in the interior
areas like Borakha, Patni, Barkathal and Sonai in Sadar subdivision. Sources
in the Sanatan Dharma Parishad said there are seven Hindu tribal groups,
which perform kirtans with traditional musical instruments.
Over the past five years, the NLFT has been consistently attacking and
killing Hindu tribals and forcing them to convert to Christianity at
gunpoint. During this period, altogether 35 Hindu tribals, including leading
Hindu tribal saint Shanti Kali Maharaj or Shanti Kumar Tripura and two
leading Vaishnavaite leaders Tachhidas Reang and Sanjit Reang have been
killed by the NLFT.

Besides, many Hindu ashrams and religious centres run by the tribals have
been destroyed by the militants. Sources said even on March 26, a group of
NLFT rebels raided the Hindu Jamatya tribal-dominated Bandarghat village in
Amarpur subdivision and beat up six tribals for practising their traditional
faith in violation of the groups diktat.

They also abducted the subdivisional secretary of the Jamatya Hoda (community
council) in Amarpur, Nilmoni Jamatya. However, they were forced to release
him under public pressure. Sources said the relentless campaign by the Jamatya Hoda Okra (head priest and community leader) Bikram Bahadur and the resistance programme organised by his followers forced the militants to lie low for sometime. But they have stepped up their activities once again. Secretary of the Jamatya Hoda Ramapda Jamatya, however, said they intensify their resistance against militancy.

where do you think they are gaining their support if not from the priests and missionaries? Also none of the latter has so far condemned such activites.