Gemma Therese

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Bree:
[QB]

Is it not true that we can NEVER be good enough for God, unless we accept his conditions?

A) This is conditional love.
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No, it is not. God is unchanging and therefore cannot have conditions.

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B) It still is depressing.

I don't see how.

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We'll never be good enough for anything because God says we won't. This is the root of Christianity (you can't argue that) - and in my opinion, knowing that God made me to be inheirantly evil and then, on PURPOSE made it so I can never be anything BUT evil without Him - well, that's manipulative at best.

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"Catholics believe that all creation is good and that evil is the wrong use of good and that without grace we use it wrong most of the time."
-Flannery O'Connor

Gemma Therese

[ July 07, 2002: Message edited by: Gemma Therese ]</p>

TooBad

Sorry, but if that was your point you didn't state it very clearly the first time around:

I'm still not entirely clear what you're trying to say. I don't know enough about Edith Stein to comment extensively on her ignorance or lack of it. I do notice that she seems to have made respected contributions to some areas of philosophical debate, and was a working academic for much of her life. Ignorance, however, is not an all-or-nothing matter. I don't know well-informed she was about science or scientific thinking. She is a very different figure, in many respects, from St Therese, and it was St Therese we were talking about when I made my comment about ignorance.

Anunnaki

Gemma is a future nun with dreams of living a life of self-depreciation on Caramel mountain. She also has a block on her computer that keeps her from typing naughty words.

I don`t think she watches South Park.

Bree

But you cannot get to Heaven without God's stamp of approval on your life! He does not shower His ultimate love (the reward of Heaven) upon you unless you FIRST accept God's conditions.

Why are you using other people's words to fight your fights?

seebs

My parents were very strict, and every time I touched very hot metal as a child, the part of my finger I touched it with was burned.

I see the whole "eternal reward" thing in terms of the natural consequences of certain basic attitudes towards the universe, not really as reward or punishment. YMMV.

Often, a well-chosen phrase can be more expressive than what you can come up with on your own, and it's appropriate to give credit if you're using a quote.

seebs

The way I always explain it is to tell the joke about the two boats and a helicopter. One of the ways God helps people is by providing them with a few billion helpers.

Bree

Agreed, seebs - I occasionally use quotes to amplify a point as well. However, I don't usually go about saying "I don't agree with you" or "I don't see it that way" and then use someone else's ideas as my own.

TooBad

Gemma....

Since you've pointed us towards many of your favourite people and their quotations, I wonder if I might return the favour in some small way. Have you ever read Albert Einstein on the subject of religion? You can find some short excerpts from his writing at <a href="http://www.stcloud.msus.edu/~lesikar/einstein/freethink.html" target="_blank">this site</a>. I don't agree with all of his conclusions, but I would recommend to anyone that they take some time to read what he had to say. It might help you gain an insight as to why some people, even after long and careful reflection, arrive at views which are very different from yours. I would be interested in your thoughts.

HelenM

*wresting thread back from some far off place it has gotten to*

I continue to be disappointed in that depression thread...last night someone else posted a long post, based on this (a quote from it):

I am convinced that Depression is spiritual warefare and demonic oppression.

*sigh*

love
Helen

St. Robert

Being a Christian does not cure a person from clinical depression. However, I do believe that Jesus is the 'Great Physician'. It is Jesus, who heals and comforts. Allowing Jesus to reside in you through the power of His Holy Spirit can deliver a person from the bondage of clinical depression. Does this mean we'll never experience depression as an emotion? Of course, not. Jesus can, however, release you from being controlled by depression. Emotions change. Jesus does not.