Vorkosigan

Hmmm....the Church may be liberal in the first world, but it is archconservative in the Third. Is it the real threat? There, it might be. In any case, if any of the Christian Churches had real power....

Michael

brighid

It’s interesting – most of the people in my office are Catholic but when we have discussed religion they definitely don’t go with what the Vatican decrees. Having grown up in the Catholic Church I can at least say that we were rarely if ever taught about or read any papal decree or encyclical. It wasn’t until I began searching for answers to the questions I had about the Bible and Catholicism that I actually read ANYTHING the Pope(s) have written. My mother is a devout, fundamentalist Catholic and yet she hasn’t read 1/10 of the things I have from the Pope. It really pisses her off when we debate (or rather argue) and I have information from the Pope she is completely unaware of.

I must admit that I am much more comfortable with Catholic rights and ceremonies – such as funerals because that is how I was socialized. I understand what’s going on and it isn’t foreign to me like some Protestant ceremonies. Perhaps Paganism wasn’t such a stretch for me because of being raised Catholic – as it retains so many of it’s Pagan roots and rituals. My problem was I could never get over the male only bull shit, virgin superiority and when I read a lot of the Bible it seemed so morbid that I had a difficult time associating it with a loving God – even if I was told otherwise. I also felt like I could not be true to my own convictions and remain Catholic. I suppose I knew too much about what the Vatican really said a good Catholic should be and it was pretty much against everything I believed in.

I think in general, Catholics are less of a threat to atheism, science and any thing rational than Protestants. For whatever reason, at least in the US, most just want to be left alone. How many Protestant organizations do you know of that are actively and vocally Pro-Choice? I can’t remember the name but I know a Catholic organization that is. Most think the Pope is a great man and he should be revered, but because so many parishes never utter a word from an encyclical and perhaps the clergy do not even read them themselves the lay people are pretty much clueless. There isn’t a Catholic in my office that isn’t using contraception, and most don’t have negative feelings towards gays or members of other faiths.

This isn’t to say that there aren’t Catholics that are just as horrible as some fundamentalist Protestants in their archaic thinking, or that there aren’t good Protestants.

For lack of a better term - Heaven forbid that Christian Churches EVER acquire any real power in this country and they manage to rip down the walls of separation of Church and State. When that day comes my family and I will be moving to another country - perhaps in the Netherlands or ANYWHERE that doesn't tolerate that SHIT!

Brighid

Henrietta

The pope's policies will definitely kill people in Africa, if anyone there is obeying them.

Throbert McGee

Well, let's not go overboard; as you acknowledged, many Catholics are totally doctrinaire, and the Church has been instrumental in helping to obstruct the passage of gay-rights bills in various states. (They often team up with fundamentalist Protestants and Mormons and Orthodox Jews for projects like this -- which is, to my mind, a show of nauseatingly hypocritical faux-ecumenism, as all the camps involved would consider the others hell-bound heretics on any other issue.)

But the remarkable thing about Catholicism, though, is that a such a rigidly hierarchical sect, which in theory ought to be monolithic in its conservativism, does indeed have a huge number of socially liberal adherents who would nonetheless self-identify as devoutly observant. (At least here in the U.S.)

hinduwoman

somewhat like myself then in respect to one's community and religion. I don't feel hinduism and atheism are mutually exclusionary.
I think the bond is an emotional one, an attachment to history and society of the community as such. Is it the same with you?

PopeInTheWoods

If you'll allow me to jump in, I have to answer yes to this question. Although I concluded quite some time ago that the Catholic god is fictional, and haven't been to church regularly for quite some time, there are still Catholic events that I participate in. My (also atheist) wife and I are our six-month-old nephew's godparents, we had a traditional Catholic wedding a few years back, and we usually participate in some Easter and Xmas events (basket blessing, midnight mass, and such). Much of this stems from my Polish ancestry, and such events are mainly family- or community-centered.

Andy (PITW)