Mike S.

I notice that when the Bushites are faced with lies and corruption in the administration they are pretty adept at coming up with explanations for them individually, as in:

- Forged nuclear docs from Niger: Well, they were taken in good faith from the British, why would we check their intelligence? they are our number 1 ally.

- Mobile chem. weapons labs: Ok, so they were inspected by Blix and found to be food testing labs. What, are we supposed to run everything past this guy first? An honest mistake.

- Truck mounted, WMD loaded, Death Drones ready to swoop down ad kill our brave soldiers: Yeah, yeah, so they just model airplanes made of balsa wood, who would think Iraqi's would have recreational items? They just mope around all day because their country sucks!

- This war is not about oil: Of course America is selling the oil field rights to American companies, this is done so the fields can be improved and thus yield far more. They need that extra to pay for repairing all the damage we just caused, and yes the money from the oil is going to be handled by a permanent American counsel which will distribute that money to only American companies for rebuilding. If the Iraqi's controlled their own oil money who knows what they would spend it on so this is really in their best interests.

- Halliburton is given $300 million contract to build Guant. Bay detention center while Cheney is still on payroll for $1 million a year: Pure coincidence, they build stuff, should they not be allowed to do any government work?

- Halliburton is given multi - million dollar contract to put out oil well fires in Iraq while Cheney is still on payroll for $1 million a year: See above.

- Halliburton is given a possibly $7 BILLION contract to upgrade oil field equipment in Iraq while Cheney is still on payroll for $1 million a year: See above again.

Blah, i have carried on too much as it is. The list of falsehoods and corruption from the Uranium Enriching Tubes to Enron seems endless with NO signs of any honesty or conscience in sight.

The question i pose to the people who believe in Bush and Company is this: While taken individually you can excuse any of the untruths the administration spews will there ever be a moment when you see the multitude of lies collectively and say to yourself "hmm, maybe these guys are dishonest after all"?

As George Junior himself said: "Fool me, uh, fool me once shame on you. Fool me twice and... uh... and... uh... you won't get fooled again"

brighid

I would be really interested in any links you have discussing Cheney still being on the Halliburton payroll! That would be a nice piece of info to have when debating with some conservatives I know.

Thanks,
Brighid

Mike S.

I can't remember where i read it originally but here is one source http://www.larouchepub.com/other/200...ocon_exit.html

Relevent passage:
Then, recent news about Vice President Dick Cheney's financial ties to Halliburton present even more of an appearance of conflict of interest. According to Pacifica radio's report in January 2003, Halliburton�the company which was headed by Cheney until the Presidential election in 2000�gave him a $20 million golden parachute, and is making billions of dollars from the war on terrorism and the drive for war on Iraq�is one of the major American companies bidding on contracts for "post-war" reconstruction of Iraq. So far, $900 million in contracts are on the line, and the figures are expected to soar into the billions if Iraq is attacked by American military "shock and awe" methods. There's one small additional detail: Halliburton is currently paying Cheney $1 million a year in uncollected fees (obtainable when he completes his term of office).

Sounds like a good deal he has going for himself although I didn't know he couldn't collect until after his term was up. The $20 million going away present should be able to sustain his lifestyle for the 4-8 years the poor guy has to live on a VP's salary.

Joe6Pack

It would seem that the Cheney's are only collecting like 162k from his former employer:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/relea...0030411-8.html

There is no mention of the total amount that is defferred

Kinross

Its money he earned in 1999 ie before being elected VP. The compensation has no bearing on any events cicera 1999. Even if Haliburton was to go belly up tomorrow he still gets the money.

Its fairly typical for an exiting CEO to get such a thing.

Mike S.

Ok, you are right, they are deferred payments from his resignation. However...

http://loper.org/~george/archives/2000/Sep/80.html
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But one employee who has made out just fine, thank you, is Dick himself! He's become wealthy in his five years as CEO. Last year alone, his paycheck from Halliburton totalled $26.4 million (he also, by the way, drew $280,000 in pay just for being on the boards of Proctor & Gamble, EDS, and Union Pacific). In addition, he's been awarded Halliburton stock options that are presently valued at $39 million.

Then there's Dick's golden parachute. He's had to resign to run for veep, but the company - in a gesture of pure altruism that has nothing to do with the fact that he might become vice president and be in the position to help Halliburton a whole lot (let's invade Iraq again!) - is giving Cheney a $20 million farewell package. included is not one but two pensions for the guy who cut benefits for ordinary Halliburton workers and who wants to privatize Social Security.
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However... the point being made is that a conflict of interest is pretty obvious. $26.4 million in pay in 1999, $39 million in stock options, and the deferred payments of a $20 million resignation package make Dick pretty suspect considering how many non-transparent government jobs Halliburton has been awarded recently.

Also, the whole point of this thread was to ask Bush loyalists how many falsehoods and shady dealings they would accept from this administration before they would begin to question it's integrity?

If you knew someone who never ever gave you truthful or correct information would you still trust them? You can excuse any individual untruth as a mistake or small misdirection even but when you look at the big picture it should be clear that you are being decieved. This is my problem with so many of these Bush followers. Why do they refuse to see that the constant stream of misinformation and corruption they are always having to defend is collectively a sign that the people they are defending are cleary malicious liars with a hidden agenda? What could they possibly have to benefit from such fanatical allegiance that they so vigorously fight against the light of truth? These are the questions I wish to have answered.

Thanks

Kinross

Can you name a politician who has ever told the truth?

Right, left, middle, thay all lie and give handouts to their friends.

As long as there is a large government to take money from one group of people and hand it to another group of people there will be large scale corruption.

Jat

60 Minutes just did a major story on this a few weeks ago. The Republicians really must think the American people are stupid.

brighid

Unfortunately, I missed that one! However, given Bush's popularity and poll ratings it is pretty obvious that many of the American people ARE stupid!

Brighid

Mike S.

Sure, most politicians are pretty dishonest and I'm not out to bash Bush because of some left/right thing. What I am saying is that this administration seems to constantly provably lie about matters of war and massive corporate coruption and yet the public just shrugs it off. People in America still go on about how Clintons blow-job lie should have lead to his impeachment to this day. Powell's ENTIRE case for war has been systematically proven to be false (on Meet the Press he went so far as to say he was fine with that) and yet people seem to have more faith in Bush than any other Pres. in my memory (that is to say Clinton, Bush Sr., and a little Reagan). Shouldn't the opposite be true?