Freethought & Rationalism Archive

tronvillain · 06-30-2002, 03:50 PM

Media-1:

Quote:

You say..."We need only behave in the correct manner." Is that the biologically correct manner or the morally correct manner? If what usually grounds atheist morality are purely biological/survival considerations, why should we bother calling our topic "morality", isn't that a bit misleading???

We need only behave in the correct manner from the perspective of our genes, and we have evolved morals so that on average the morally correct manner will be the biologically correct manner. What grounds atheist morality are definitely not biological/survival considerations - they simply explain why we have the morals we have.

Quote:

Instead, we should just plan for a humanist biological brave new world. But in that case we should stop calling our subject "morality" and start to admit that what we're really advocating is a non-theistic humanist religion that seeks to promote human survival. Why we ought to get excited about such a religion is beyond me.

That human survival is basic explanation of morality does not imply that moral decisions are those which promote human survival. It is an explanation, not a goal. You are trying to say that we should ignore morality and simply act in the best interests of our gene, but there is no apparent reason to do this.

Quote:

I don't think we're talking about morality anymore. BTW, what is so "freethinking" about the humanist religious goal of promoting non-moral "morals" which are really just designed to promote human survival?

Nothing, but then I haven't noticed anyone doing that. Humanists act to promote human survival because of their morals, or so I assume, since I'm not much of a humanist.

JL · 06-30-2002, 03:56 PM

Media 1 wrote:

Quote:

You say..."We need only behave in the correct manner." Is that the biologically correct manner or the morally correct manner? If what usually grounds atheist morality are purely biological/survival considerations, why should we bother calling our topic "morality", isn't that a bit misleading???

Did you read the entire post or just pick a sentence out of context that was easy for you to refute?

You seemed to be looking for, in so many words, why humans have evolved a conscience, which I attempted to provide. I never said questions of morality could be answered from an evolutionary perspective.

rebelnerd · 06-30-2002, 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Media-1:
- why should we bother calling our topic "morality", isn't that a bit misleading???

Our topic is called "Stupid, Vain People"

Filo

rebelnerd · 06-30-2002, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Media-1:
Two can play that game! Here is an equally valid question for you: whatever your god is, what would YOU do if that god told you to kill a child?

I'm an atheist, I don't believe in god(s). That renders the second part of the question moot.

Filo

Dr Rick · 06-30-2002, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Media-1:
...let's get back to what specifically pisses you off about the woman that killed her kids.

Good idea! Let's start by having you explain why you are 'pissed' when what happened was part of "God's plan." Those little tykes are in a 'better' place with God right now; why should you be angry?

Rick

rebelnerd · 06-30-2002, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Media-1:
My God wouldn't give me such a command. But, if I'm wrong, and God surprised me with such an awful order, I seriously doubt that my faith would be strong enough to even consider doing it.

Your god only exists in your mind. So if you were given such a command, it would originate in your mind and come from nowhere else. People who hear "voices" which is what the case would be if you heard god talking to you are usually diagnosed as schizophrenic and need psychotherapy.

Filo

One of the last sane · 06-30-2002, 04:43 PM

Schizophrenics need drugs too, Filo. Just psychotherapy generally won't do the trick.

rebelnerd · 06-30-2002, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Media-1:
You say..."We need only behave in the correct manner." Is that the biologically correct manner or the morally correct manner?

Why would they be mutually exclusive?

Filo

One of the last sane · 06-30-2002, 04:44 PM

You know the scary part? If Media-1 ever loses his god, it appears that he will have no personal moral code to guide him.

rebelnerd · 06-30-2002, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by One of last of the sane:
Schizophrenics need drugs too, Filo. Just psychotherapy generally won't do the trick.

You are absolutely correct, I pretty much meant the whole package.

Filo

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06-30-2002, 04:43 PM	#127
One of the last sane Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: hereabouts Posts: 734	Schizophrenics need drugs too, Filo. Just psychotherapy generally won't do the trick.

06-30-2002, 04:44 PM	#129
One of the last sane Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: hereabouts Posts: 734	You know the scary part? If Media-1 ever loses his god, it appears that he will have no personal moral code to guide him.

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