Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Eudaimonist · 08-09-2002, 01:39 PM

Gemma, thirty years ago, before there was solid scientific evidence that linked smoking with an increased risk of cancer, people who smoked cigarettes did not choose death. They chose to smoke. The unknown consequence of smoking was death. Of course, science established the link, and so now we know. Even before science did this, we knew with rational certainty that death is real, whether potentially caused by smoking or not.

What rational reason is there to think that hell exists, and that failing to participate in Catholic services with sufficient frequency lands one in hell?

Until you can provide this information we are justified in being unconvinced, just as if you had warned us that eating popcorn leads to spontaneous human combustion, so don't eat popcorn!

[ August 09, 2002: Message edited by: Eudaimonist ]

Queen of Swords · 08-09-2002, 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gemma Therese:

I would assume none of you... attend Confession at least annually.

Something about being in a small private place with a submissive person can put priests in a terrible state of temptation, don't you think?

Gemma Therese · 08-09-2002, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by QueenofSwords:


Something about being in a small private place with a submissive person can put priests in a terrible state of temptation, don't you think?

I'm guessing that's a "no".

Gemma Therese

DarkBronzePlant · 08-09-2002, 03:03 PM

Gemma,

Just out of curiosity, is your plan to try to beat into everyone's head "if you don't believe in god you'll go to hell," thinking that eventually some of us will believe it if we hear it enough?

Word of advice: if you want to convince any of the atheists here of anything, provide some kind of evidence. Otherwise, all you're doing is working on a serious case of althritis.

-DBP

daemon · 08-09-2002, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gemma Therese:
I would assume none of you attend Catholic Mass weekly, or recieve Communion during the Easter season, or attend Confession at least annually.

Now you know, you're in a state of mortal sin. You can't plead ignorance. And becuase you do not believe it to be a mortal sin, it does not lose its seriousness.

You still don't get it, Gemma. It's not a mortal sin unless we think it's wrong. We don't, so it's not. Different class of sin altogether.

daemon · 08-09-2002, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gemma Therese:
God does not wish Hell on anyone. PEOPLE CHOOSE HELL.

Gemma, no one would ever choose Hell.

I think this demonstrates one of the most pernicious problems with religion--revelation trumps fact. It doesn't matter how strenuously the unbeliever insists that they are, in fact, happy, well-adjusted, and not following the Bogeyman; the "truth" of the matter has been revealed to the adherent.

Gemma, if nothing else, please, please, please stop insisting you know what we want better than we do. It does nothing but make you appear delusional.

Gemma Therese · 08-09-2002, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by daemon:
Gemma, no one would ever choose Hell.

I think this strates one of the most pernicious problems with religion--revelation trumps fact. It doesn't matter how strenuously the unbeliever insists that they are, in fact, happy, well-adjusted, and not following the Bogeyman; the "truth" of the matter has been revealed to the adherent.

Gemma, if nothing else, please, please, please stop insisting you know what we want better than we do. It does nothing but make you appear delusional.

You're strongest conviction is not true if it is objectively false.

Gemma Therese

ex-preacher · 08-09-2002, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gemma Therese:


You're strongest conviction is not true if it is objectively false.

Gemma Therese

Likewise.

Gemma Therese · 08-09-2002, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ex-preacher:


Likewise.

Yawn.

ex-preacher · 08-09-2002, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gemma Therese:


Yawn.

Sigh.

08-09-2002, 01:39 PM	#81
Eudaimonist Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Sundsvall, Sweden Posts: 3,159	Gemma, thirty years ago, before there was solid scientific evidence that linked smoking with an increased risk of cancer, people who smoked cigarettes did not choose death. They chose to smoke. The unknown consequence of smoking was death. Of course, science established the link, and so now we know. Even before science did this, we knew with rational certainty that death is real, whether potentially caused by smoking or not. What rational reason is there to think that hell exists, and that failing to participate in Catholic services with sufficient frequency lands one in hell? Until you can provide this information we are justified in being unconvinced, just as if you had warned us that eating popcorn leads to spontaneous human combustion, so don't eat popcorn! [ August 09, 2002: Message edited by: Eudaimonist ]</p>

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08-09-2002, 03:03 PM	#84
DarkBronzePlant Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: San Francisco, CA USA Posts: 3,568	Gemma, Just out of curiosity, is your plan to try to beat into everyone's head "if you don't believe in god you'll go to hell," thinking that eventually some of us will believe it if we hear it enough? Word of advice: if you want to convince any of the atheists here of anything, provide some kind of evidence. Otherwise, all you're doing is working on a serious case of althritis. -DBP

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