Calzaer

Troll troll troll your boat, gently down the stream...

Jesse

You mean "sex" between children of the same age? Well, I've never heard of kids getting in legal trouble for playing doctor, although I don't think most people are capable of actual sex until around the age they begin puberty (I could be wrong about this). Similarly, I don't know the exact laws concerning sex with mentally retarded people, but I would imagine there might be cases where there would be penalties for a mentally "normal" person having sex with a mentally retarded person but no penalties for two people with similar handicaps having sex with each other.

Totalitarianist

Why call people names?

hezekiah jones

Originally posted by Jesse
"Children cannot consent" is a legal issue, not a scientific one.

You'd think that would be the end of the discussion.

Jesse

Actually, if this hadn't just been moved from MF&P, I'd be inclined to move it there. I'll wait a little bit to see if this mutates into a discussion of the cognitive abilities of children, or of the psychological effects of child sexual abuse by adults vs. the pychological effects of children playing doctor with each other, or something similar, but if not I'll probably ask permission from the moderators of MF&P to move it back.

faust

I'll bite,

Totalitarianist:
what do you mean by "form of a child's brain"?

be clear and precise.

melinie007

Gene G. Abela, Judith V. Beckerb and Jerry Cunningham-Rathnerc,
"Complications and consent in sex between children and adult" International Journal of Law and Psychiatry Volume 7, Issue 1 , 1984, Pages 89-103

It seems to me, Totalatrian, that you should do some research of your own. Seeing as the question you are asking is seemingly one of science and not morality (although the scientific facts should affect our moral judgement) I see no reason why you seek other people to go find studies that have been done and bring them back to you.

You tell us all that we have the burden of proof. I am saying you are the one making the contentious claim, you can learn to find facts that support it yourself. Further, the point is no matter with whom the burden lies it is poor form to think you need to offer nothing yourself and merely throw out the challenge that people come up with some grand explanation of children's cognitive capacities.

I am sorry I couldn't find a link online, and yes, 1984 is rather out of date. You can go the library and read this if you want. While your at the library, for discussion purposes, see if you can find something that supports your point of view. Oh - but the burden of proff is on me right??????? Why should you bother to find out what has been said on the issue???

melinie007

Further, although little research has been done to the concept of children consenting to sex (for obvious reasons) much research has been done into the concept of child's capacity to consent more generally.

Specifically, for the ability of children to consent to medical treatment. It is believed that some children do have the capicity to consent for medical treatment - but it has been shown that most children do not have the capacities at a young age to fully understand the consequences of there actions. etc.

Godot

As an aside to the previous post, in this country the age of consent for medical proceedures is tenuously set at 15 [my reference for this is a psychologist and member of the UC Ethics Committee].
How this extends in legal parlance is beyond me though.

echidna

T, that is the entire point as I'm sure you're aware. Consent is not the simple act of saying "yes". In any meaningful sense, it must involve a degree of understanding. And as I'm sure you're well aware, children (depending on your age definition which you still haven't defined) are simply not experienced enough to even begin to understand the consequences of their actions.

Accepting a child's "yes" as consent, is entirely equivalent to accepting the "yes" from a person who you've just lied to, or the "yes" of a tortured prisoner, or the "yes" from a girl about to be date-raped under rohypnol, or the "yes" from a alzeimer's sufferer. Really, it's a very simple issue here.

As such, ANY act by a child (including your example) cannot really involve any meaningful (or legal) sense of the word "consent".

You might also care to respond to Jesse's post as well.