FRDB Archives

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.


Go Back   FRDB Archives > Archives > IIDB ARCHIVE: 200X-2003, PD 2007 > IIDB Philosophical Forums (PRIOR TO JUN-2003)
Welcome, Peter Kirby.
You last visited: Yesterday at 05:55 AM

 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 12-28-2002, 04:00 PM   #11
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 633
Default

Okay, AIF, you guys love to ask your critics for their cites. So, where are they?

Hezekiah, if you're talking about his silence during oral questioning, I am puzzled myself but I've read some of his decisions and I don't see him as a mediocrity. The best one I've read was his term limits opinion.
fromtheright is offline  
Old 12-28-2002, 08:02 PM   #12
Contributor
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Los Angeles area
Posts: 40,549
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by GaryP
Why didn't Al Gore's campaign do a better job of pointing out that Bush had said that Scalia & Thomas would be his prototypes for judicial appointments?

. . .
Gore's campaign did a very good job of publicizing this quote among people who knew what it meant. Unfortunately, there was a counter compaign by the Greens and Ralph Nader which kept pounding the assertion that Bush's appointments to the Texas bench were not that bad or that's just scaremongering. Bush himself was trying to sound like a moderate.

I'm still waiting for Nader to apologize.
Toto is offline  
Old 12-29-2002, 05:06 PM   #13
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Spokane, WA
Posts: 3,733
Default

fromtheright:

Check out the recent book Narrowing the Nation's Power for a compelling critique of the radical activism of the Rehnquist/Scalia court. It is written by a conservative federal judge, John Noonan, who is appalled at the direction the current court is taking in many areas of law.

As regards Clarence Thomas, I've been convinced since his confirmation hearings that he is in way, way over his head intellectually on the Court. I particularly recall a question put to him by Senator Leahy which asked him, more or less, "Judge Thomas, since Brown v. Board, and other than Roe v. Wade (which Thomas refused to discuss throughout the hearings), what do you consider to be the most important Supreme Court cases?"

Now, that's the sort of question any minimally competent could answer quite easily. A second-year law student could answer it easily. I'd bet that you could come up with a pretty good answer, given your stated interest in constitutional law. I know I could answer it pretty well.

Thomas, however, couldn't connect with this big, fat softball question that would have done Larry King proud. His answer was, more or less, "Senator, I'd have to go back and give that question some thought." Pathetic.

Mark

{edited by Toto for formatting - extra line feed}
MarkW is offline  
Old 12-30-2002, 11:10 AM   #14
Contributor
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Los Angeles area
Posts: 40,549
Default

The Great Mentioner continues to mention Gonzalez as a prime candidate, since the anti-affirmative action president still wants to gain favor with Hispanic voters. But the religious right thinks he might <gasp> push the court to the left if he replaces Rehnquist as Chief Justice.

Bush Ally is Top Contender for Supreme Court

Quote:
As White House counsel, Gonzales has moved to strengthen Bush's power as a wartime commander by saying, for example, that the president on his own authority can designate terrorism suspects as "enemy combatants" and lock them up without criminal charges, a trial or even access to a lawyer.

At the same time, he has moved to shield the White House from outside scrutiny. His office refused a request from the General Accounting Office to learn who met with Vice President Cheney when he was formulating the administration's energy plan.

The GAO went to court, but the administration won the first round when Judge John Bates, a new Bush appointee, threw out the lawsuit.

Gonzales also won plaudits from conservatives for ending the American Bar Assn.'s long-standing special role in evaluating judicial nominees and for surrounding himself with young lawyers with conservative credentials. They include Brett Kavanaugh, 37, formerly a key staffer for Independent Counsel Kenneth W. Starr and the reputed author of much of the "Starr Report" that called for President Clinton's impeachment.

Nonetheless, many conservatives have remained wary of Gonzales, believing he has a moderate-to-liberal view on issues such as affirmative action and abortion.

. . .

Last year, in an interview with The Times, Gonzales said he was not troubled with the notion of using a person's race or ethnicity as one factor in their favor.

"I know that I've been helped because of my ethnicity," he said. . . .
Toto is offline  
Old 12-30-2002, 11:15 AM   #15
Contributor
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Los Angeles area
Posts: 40,549
Default

Narrowing the Nation's Power by John Noonan
Toto is offline  
Old 12-30-2002, 01:09 PM   #16
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 2,635
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by copernicus
Bush wants to pack the Supreme Court as badly as FDR did. It looks like he may be even more
successful.
You are aware that what historians (and other educated folk) mean when they refer to FDR's attempt to "pack" the Court, are you not?

It had nothing to do with filling upcoming vacancies with judges you found more philosophically in tune with your own administration. FDR actually attempted to add several seats to the Supreme Court so he could simply appoint NEW justices that he liked.

Bush, as far as I know, has proposed nothing of the kind. Unless you have evidence to the contrary.
Layman is offline  
Old 12-30-2002, 10:52 PM   #17
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Bellevue, WA
Posts: 1,531
Default

Yes, Layman, I am well aware of FDR's attempt to add new Justices. That effort failed, but the Court weakened FDR's proposal by reversing itself on one law and approving several others that Roosevelt favored. That was when Justice Owen Roberts made "the switch in time that saved nine". Before the end of his term, Roosevelt had managed to appoint 8 of the 9 judges, thus packing the court with liberal justices.

Bush is poised to create a similar shift, but in a conservative direction. He has made no secret of his desire to appoint ideologues like Scalia and Thomas.
copernicus is offline  
Old 12-31-2002, 09:01 AM   #18
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 2,635
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by copernicus
Yes, Layman, I am well aware of FDR's attempt to add new Justices. That effort failed, but the Court weakened FDR's proposal by reversing itself on one law and approving several others that Roosevelt favored. That was when Justice Owen Roberts made "the switch in time that saved nine". Before the end of his term, Roosevelt had managed to appoint 8 of the 9 judges, thus packing the court with liberal justices.

Bush is poised to create a similar shift, but in a conservative direction. He has made no secret of his desire to appoint ideologues like Scalia and Thomas.
There is no similarity between Bush's plan to appoint Justices he agrees with philosophically and Roosevelt's attempt to pack the Court. So far, Bush has done what ever President tries to do with the courts. Replace retiring judges and justices with judges more in line with his own philosophy.

The comparison fails. In fact, its so misleading as to be dishonest.
Layman is offline  
Old 12-31-2002, 09:17 AM   #19
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Lancaster, OH
Posts: 1,792
Default

Speaking of dishonesty, didn't Bush run as a moderate, "compassionate" conservative? Reaching out across the aisle and all that?
GaryP is offline  
Old 12-31-2002, 10:53 AM   #20
Contributor
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Los Angeles area
Posts: 40,549
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Layman
There is no similarity between Bush's plan to appoint Justices he agrees with philosophically and Roosevelt's attempt to pack the Court. So far, Bush has done what ever[y] President tries to do with the courts. Replace retiring judges and justices with judges more in line with his own philosophy.

The comparison fails. In fact, its so misleading as to be dishonest.
Not "every" President - only the Presidents since Reagan. And even then, previous presidents have at least paid lip service to the ideal of an independent judiciary chosen from the best qualified, and have in fact ended up appointing justices who did not vote along party lines.

Bush, however, no longer seeks the ABA rating for his judicial appointments, and is seeking out young, ideologically committed conservatives who can be trusted to follow the party line. The comparison with Roosevelt is not exact. Roosevelt had actually won an election, and felt he had a mandate to do something about a national emergency, and only some hidebound justices with an antiquated view of government power were twarting the democratic will. Still, even liberal scholars who value the ideal of an independent judiciary can fault him for his heavy handedness.

Bush, on the other hand, gained the presidency through a very partisan and legally dispreputable Supreme Court decision. He is using his position to reconfigure the judicial philosophy of the Supreme Court, not in response to an emergency or the will of the majority, but for his own ideological ends. He has been aided in this by Senate Republicans who held up large numbers of Clinton's appointments, creating a lot of vacancies for him to fill (and who then whined about Democrats holding up Bush's appointments.)

So the comparison is not exact, but for you to label it "so misleading as to be dishonest" shows a lack of imagination on your part.
Toto is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 04:08 AM.

Top

This custom BB emulates vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.