randman

So you guys are stupid enough to believe that these men with Phds just don't yet understand evolution. I am sorry, but one doesn't need to be an evolutionary biologists in order to understand the basics of evolution and decide whether one thinks the evidence supports the theory.
Obviously, these learned men reject your belief, though it appears to pain some of you so. At least, when the Christian evangelist is likewise concerned over your rejection of his beliefs, the gospel, he is actually concerned over the destruction of your soul in hell whereas there is no harm for anyone in rejecting evolution.
These men have heard it, understand it, and don't see the evidence for it.
Also, isn't it silly to epect them to choose the study and practice of evolution if they don't believe in it.
DuH!!!
And it amazes me that so many of you actually believe that there are no scientists that don't accept evolution. It's like you live in a fantasy world.

[ June 01, 2002: Message edited by: randman ]</p>

lpetrich

randman:
So you guys are stupid enough to believe that these men with Phds just don't yet understand evolution.

It is more likely that these gentlemen have preferred to close their mind to close their mind to the idea of evolution; Jonathan Wells claimed that he wanted to get a biology Ph.D. just so he could destroy evolutionary biology by posing as an insider.

Or consider the double life of a certain Dr. Andrew Snelling -- is he an old-earth mainstream geologist or a young-earth Noah's-Flood geologist?

I am sorry, but one doesn't need to be an evolutionary biologists in order to understand the basics of evolution and decide whether one thinks the evidence supports the theory.

But one ought to be able to understand it before one jumps to conclusions about it.

At least, when the Christian evangelist is likewise concerned over your rejection of his beliefs, the gospel, he is actually concerned over the destruction of your soul in hell whereas there is no harm for anyone in rejecting evolution.

And I suppose that there is also no harm in believing that the Earth is flat or that Jesus Christ had once miraculously created marijuana for his followers to smoke.

And it amazes me that so many of you actually believe that there are no scientists that don't accept evolution. It's like you live in a fantasy world.

Grow up, randman, and stop acting like a big baby. The large majority of creationists with such credentials have worked in fields where they can avoid running into biological evolution or the great age of the Universe in the course of their work.

But has anyone done a lot of work in evolutionary biology and then come to reject it completely? SERIOUSLY.

RufusAtticus

Wells is an interesting case. He went back to school to challenge prevailing science. That's fine. However, he descided to get a PhD in a different field then the one he wanted to challenge. If he wanted to challenge evolution in a scientific manner, he'd enrolled in the Integrative Biology program at Berkely, instead of the Mol. Biology program. As it was he chose a program in which he could avoid evolution for the most part, yet still make it look like he had scientific credentials in the field.

I think it was Kurt Wise, who had a crisis of faith and ended up choosing his interpretation of the bible ove science. I think he admits that the evidence for evolution is there, but he doesn't think it is true.

~~RvFvS~~

RufusAtticus

I have yet to encounter a creationist who actually understands evolution, the science behind it, and the evidence for it.

I don't think creationists are deciding anything. They have either been lied to about science and/or are so weak in faith that they can't allow their perception of God to change, even to grow.

~~RvFvS~~

[ June 02, 2002: Message edited by: RufusAtticus ]</p>

hezekiah jones

Therefore the Bible, as the sole alternative, must be true.

Is that how it works?

Daydreamer

We never said that - we said they never studied it through the traditional channel - by studying ecological/evolutionary biology at a respectable university.

True - but without the degree your opinion is of no value.

First, your intentionally slandering evolution by relating it to believe and hence faith.

Second, its not the rejection that pains us, but that fact that they reject evolution by sticking their fingers in their ears and shouting "LA LA I CAN'T HEAR YOUR GODLESS EVILUTIONISM RELIGION".

Which assumes the existance of hell, the existance of the soul, and that Xianity is indeed the 'One and Only True Religion" (TM)

Rejection of reason is always dangerous.

Then they are blind.

Would you be pissed if we said Xianity was total bunk without studying it?

DuH!!!

We never said this, nor do we believe this. What we believe is that no scientist rejects the theory of common decent unless they were already biased against it through various degrees of Biblical literalism.

I'm afraid I'm not the one who believes in people turning water into wine, or coming back from the dead.

You, sir, make a crappy troll.

Coragyps

Daydreamer just said it well: Goya said it nicely, too:<a href="http://www.museum.cornell.edu/HFJ/handbook/hb128.html" target="_blank">The Sleep of Reason Brings Forth Monsters.</a> Wake up, Randman.

foursquareman

Are we not all free thinkers? Why then must we believe that YEC's are stupid, just because they make up their mind about evolution.

PS. since when does the bible support flat-earth and jesus giving marijuana to his followers?

hezekiah jones

That they're stupid is just an amusing sideshow. More importantly they've been trying to have their bullshit taught in the public schools here for 75 years, with no sign of letting up.

Liquidrage

Does this thread mean that if someone posts a link to say, 1,000 Phds that accept evolution that our side wins by an appeal to authority?

Who would have thought it was so easy?

What follows is an e-mail that I received from a Creationist. I challenged her to come up with credentials for the so called scientists that she was quoting. I guess that I should have known that if the tobacco companies could find scientific whores to back up their bankrupt position that creationism could do the same.
Who are these jokers?

Did you ever really doubt their would be?

There are even Phd's that believe aliens from the planet Xylgor are fixing professional bowling.

I know many people that no matter what you show them, they will never waiver from their beliefs.
Logic and evidence will not change their minds. They need to be deprogrammed.