Freethought & Rationalism Archive

beoba · 09-30-2002, 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Oxidizing Material:
I was kicked out of Scouts.

Sound's like you've got a story to tell.

I left.

Tom Sawyer · 09-30-2002, 01:23 PM

I was in Scouts all the way up to 13 or 14. I never encountered any kind of religion throughout any of it.

By the sounds of things, though, they appear to be pushing it on the youngin's a little more these days.

Buffman · 09-30-2002, 01:50 PM

peteyh

By the sounds of things, though, they appear to be pushing it on the youngin's a little more these days.

Based on my former relationship with the BSA and with what I just learned above, I would consider that to be a gross understatement.

When I was a member, there was just one medal awarded for "God and Country," not individual ones for each specific religious faith belief. Perhaps that change stems from their legal advisors' recommendations in order to be better able to argue that the BSA meets the qualifications for the retention of their Federal Charter.

crazyfingers · 10-05-2002, 07:45 PM

FYI, my letter was published in my town paper yesterday. I'll let you know if there is any follow-up or fall-out.

GunnerJ · 10-07-2002, 10:41 AM

FWIW, I was in the Scouts until I was 17, and made the rank of Star. I thought your letter was great. Even while I was a theist, I felt that the discrimatory policies of the Scouts were wrongheaded. My agnostic dad was the Scoutmaster of my troop for a while, and he said that if any of the scouts of adults said that they were gay, he'd never mention it to anyone, he just didn't care about that policy. He said he disliked other troops sposored by churches who made adults and kids answer questionaires about their religion o see if they're "suitable." Pretty much everyone in the troop agreed, we were kind of laid back.

Oxidizing Material · 10-07-2002, 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by alphatronics:


Sound's like you've got a story to tell.

I left.

That I do.

I was forced into Scouts when I was extremely young, maybe no more than 8-11, I forget when. It's hard for me to remember, but I'm pretty sure the Scout leader started everything off with a prayer. She ALSO had a few Eagle(?) scouts of her own (two 18 year old boys) that hung out in the hall and smoked in the back. I was the subject of their torment nearly every meeting. They'd actually throw me around and the scout leader would do dick all to stop them. "They're just acting like boys" was her excuse. My parents put the blame squarely on me. If two Eagle scouts were making me the object of their attention then OBVIOUSFUCKINGLY I was to blame because two God fearing Eagle couldn't pick on a poor, defenceless child half their age and a quarter their size.

So I started to get really angry and fearful in Scouts and still we had that fucking prayer every meeting. I wasn't Christian (Twas Wiccan at that time, I believe. I think I deconverted when I was about 13, not too sure, as my memory at this moment is fogged) and after never having any of my prayers answered, I finally rose my hand one day afterward and made the mistake of asking my Scout leader the following question:

"Why do we pray when it has no effect at all?"

You'd think I'd just punched her in the ovaries, she was so pissed off. I was the object of torment from then on by most of the Scouts and the leader herself until I just could take it any more and one night when she was yelling at me for something or other I lost it and flipped her off, telling her to "Fuck off!".

I was never allowed back.

I hate Scouts.

4th Generation Atheist · 10-08-2002, 06:53 AM

Shit OM, can't say I blame you.

Yet another reason to be glad for atheist parents, even if it sometimes singled me out as a kid: the folks at least were on my side. <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" />

crazyfingers · 10-08-2002, 07:05 AM

My brother was a Boy Scout. He had Downs Syndrome and was in a troop for the mentally handicapped. Overall it was good for him because he made friends with others like him.

But they taught him to pray to Jesus. Of course he had no idea what he was praying about or what a Jesus concept is, but he would say his prayers before bed every night because it was what the boy scouts taught him to do.

This absolutely infuriated my dad. He was completely livid. But my mom convinced my dad that my brother didn't understand what he was doing so dad didn't complain to the troop leader.

It's interesting that the boy scouts decided that it was their job to teach my brother Christianity.

[ October 08, 2002: Message edited by: crazyfingers ]

crazyfingers · 10-11-2002, 03:36 PM

Well, there was a response in my town paper today. Unfortunately they seem to have forgotten to post it to the website. They did post mine.

The response is quite long - probably twice the size of mine. There was a lot of God stuff in it. It had the familiar ring of the oppressed Christian. I was called intolerant for suggesting that people of goodwill should encourage the Boy Scouts to stop their religious discrimination.

And a lot of words were CAPITALIZED.

RufusAtticus · 10-11-2002, 03:49 PM

Please post it here as soon as you can.

10-08-2002, 07:05 AM	#18
crazyfingers Contributor Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Massachusetts, USA Posts: 13,699	My brother was a Boy Scout. He had Downs Syndrome and was in a troop for the mentally handicapped. Overall it was good for him because he made friends with others like him. But they taught him to pray to Jesus. Of course he had no idea what he was praying about or what a Jesus concept is, but he would say his prayers before bed every night because it was what the boy scouts taught him to do. This absolutely infuriated my dad. He was completely livid. But my mom convinced my dad that my brother didn't understand what he was doing so dad didn't complain to the troop leader. It's interesting that the boy scouts decided that it was their job to teach my brother Christianity. [ October 08, 2002: Message edited by: crazyfingers ]</p>

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09-30-2002, 01:23 PM	#12
Tom Sawyer Talk Freethought Staff Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Toronto, eh Posts: 42,293	I was in Scouts all the way up to 13 or 14. I never encountered any kind of religion throughout any of it. By the sounds of things, though, they appear to be pushing it on the youngin's a little more these days.

09-30-2002, 01:50 PM	#13
Buffman Beloved Deceased Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: central Florida Posts: 3,546	peteyh By the sounds of things, though, they appear to be pushing it on the youngin's a little more these days. Based on my former relationship with the BSA and with what I just learned above, I would consider that to be a gross understatement. When I was a member, there was just one medal awarded for "God and Country," not individual ones for each specific religious faith belief. Perhaps that change stems from their legal advisors' recommendations in order to be better able to argue that the BSA meets the qualifications for the retention of their Federal Charter.

10-05-2002, 07:45 PM	#14
crazyfingers Contributor Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Massachusetts, USA Posts: 13,699	FYI, my letter was published in my town paper yesterday. I'll let you know if there is any follow-up or fall-out.

10-07-2002, 10:41 AM	#15
GunnerJ Banned Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: a place where i can list whatever location i want Posts: 4,871	FWIW, I was in the Scouts until I was 17, and made the rank of Star. I thought your letter was great. Even while I was a theist, I felt that the discrimatory policies of the Scouts were wrongheaded. My agnostic dad was the Scoutmaster of my troop for a while, and he said that if any of the scouts of adults said that they were gay, he'd never mention it to anyone, he just didn't care about that policy. He said he disliked other troops sposored by churches who made adults and kids answer questionaires about their religion o see if they're "suitable." Pretty much everyone in the troop agreed, we were kind of laid back.

10-08-2002, 06:53 AM	#17
4th Generation Atheist Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Tower of Ecthelion...by the Starbuck's Posts: 1,815	Shit OM, can't say I blame you. Yet another reason to be glad for atheist parents, even if it sometimes singled me out as a kid: the folks at least were on my side. <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" />

10-11-2002, 03:36 PM	#19
crazyfingers Contributor Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Massachusetts, USA Posts: 13,699	Well, there was a response in my town paper today. Unfortunately they seem to have forgotten to post it to the website. They did post mine. The response is quite long - probably twice the size of mine. There was a lot of God stuff in it. It had the familiar ring of the oppressed Christian. I was called intolerant for suggesting that people of goodwill should encourage the Boy Scouts to stop their religious discrimination. And a lot of words were CAPITALIZED.

10-11-2002, 03:49 PM	#20
RufusAtticus Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: NCSU Posts: 5,853	Please post it here as soon as you can.

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