Freethought & Rationalism Archive

BioBeing · 04-15-2003, 09:32 PM

If the KJV is inerrant, where are the unicorns now?

Quote:

Numbers 23:22
God brought them out of Egypt; he hath as it were the strength of an unicorn.

And why does the NASB, NIV etc use "ox" instead of unicorn?

Badfish · 04-15-2003, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BioBeing
If the KJV is inerrant, where are the unicorns now?

And why does the NASB, NIV etc use "ox" instead of unicorn?

Because maybe those aren't good translations. If the Original text said Unicorn, then it must have meant unicorn.

If God said there were unicorns, then there must have been unicorns, maybe they went extinct.

Wildernesse: Earlier English translations could be correct.

Mike: It defends itself.

Badfish · 04-15-2003, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by yguy
And we know the Council of Nicea got it right because...?

Because......it's inspired?

yguy · 04-15-2003, 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Badfish
Because......it's inspired?

If it's inspired, how come it has God countenancing a guy sacrificing his daughter in His name? How come it says Lot was a righteous man and then has him offering his daughters up to be gang raped by the Sodomites?

And if it IS inspired, how do you know the Book of Enoch, the Books of Adam and Eve, or the Gospel according to Nicodemus aren't inspired too? Because a bunch of clerics said so 1700 years ago? Who was it who said, "Put not your faith in men"?

BioBeing · 04-15-2003, 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Badfish
Because maybe those aren't good translations. If the Original text said Unicorn, then it must have meant unicorn.

If God said there were unicorns, then there must have been unicorns, maybe they went extinct.

But, apparently, the correct word is not unicorn but ox.

Quote:

Certain poetical passages of the biblical Old Testament refer to a strong and splendid horned animal called re�em. This word was translated �unicorn� or �rhinoceros� in many versions of the Bible, but many modern translations prefer �wild ox� (aurochs), which is the correct meaning of the Hebrew re�em

(From the Encylopedia Britannica, cited on http://www.apologeticspress.org/rr/rr2000/r&r0004b.htm

Or how about

Quote:

So what was the animal described in the Bible as the 'unicorn'? The most important point to remember is that while the Bible writers were inspired and infallible, translations are another thing again. The word used in the Hebrew is 'reem'. This has been translated in various languages as monoceros, unicornis, unicorn, einhorn and eenhorn, all of which mean 'one horn'. However, the word 'reem' is not known to have such a meaning. Many Jewish translations simply left it untranslated, because they were not sure which creature was being referred to.

Archaeology has in fact provided a powerful clue to the likely meaning of 'reem'. Mesopotamian reliefs have been excavated which show King Assurnasirpal hunting oxen with one horn. The associated texts show that this animal was called 'rimu'. It is thus highly likely that this was the 'reem' of the Bible, a wild ox.

From http://www.answersingenesis.org/docs2/4244cen_m1992.asp

Badfish · 04-15-2003, 10:27 PM

Ok, then it was a Rhinoceros, is that important?

The reference has it listed as likened to a Unicorn.

The Frood Dude · 04-15-2003, 10:36 PM

[fundiehat]

The Bible is God's inerrant word to mankind for all generations. The AV 1611 is the most holy and pure translation because it says "authorized" right on the cover. And God likes to use symbols, so KING James=KING Jesus=most reliable translation.

You can tell the Bible is true, because it says so itself. Right on page 683 it clearly says you can trust it. God wouldn't want man to be lost, so God makes sure everybody can have access to a good translation. After 1611, this is clear.

You have to accept some of this by faith, and then Jesus will show it to you. The Holy Spirit will illuminate your heart and mind regarding the truth of Scripture.

Some people attack the Bible. They see things that they think are contradictions just because they don't understand. The mind of man is depraved and wicked. Man's wisdom tries to discredit the Bible, rather than accepting by faith.

And some fall prey to Satan's lies. Satan tries to deceive the world about God and has attacked God's Holy word. Sometimes man is influenced by Satan's lies and repeats them to others. Some do it intentionally, like evil atheists (who also take candy from babies), and some do it because they are deceived (like liberal so-called Christians.)

I hope this clears this up. [/fundiehat]

Badfish · 04-16-2003, 12:45 AM

Sounds pretty close Frood.

mike_decock · 04-16-2003, 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Badfish
Mike: It defends itself.

Why are you defending it, then?

- Mike...

Jack the Bodiless · 04-16-2003, 08:30 AM

What about the censorship in the KJV?

Examples: translating Leviathan's giant penis as a "tail" and referring to a woman's uterus as her "thigh".

Of course, we have barely scratched the surface of the great mass of Biblical errors and contradictions yet. The main reason for not believing the Bible to be inerrant is because it is not inerrant, regardless of what certain verses say.

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04-15-2003, 10:27 PM	#36
Badfish Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Death Valley, CA Posts: 1,738	Ok, then it was a Rhinoceros, is that important? The reference has it listed as likened to a Unicorn.

04-15-2003, 10:36 PM	#37
The Frood Dude Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 41	[fundiehat] The Bible is God's inerrant word to mankind for all generations. The AV 1611 is the most holy and pure translation because it says "authorized" right on the cover. And God likes to use symbols, so KING James=KING Jesus=most reliable translation. You can tell the Bible is true, because it says so itself. Right on page 683 it clearly says you can trust it. God wouldn't want man to be lost, so God makes sure everybody can have access to a good translation. After 1611, this is clear. You have to accept some of this by faith, and then Jesus will show it to you. The Holy Spirit will illuminate your heart and mind regarding the truth of Scripture. Some people attack the Bible. They see things that they think are contradictions just because they don't understand. The mind of man is depraved and wicked. Man's wisdom tries to discredit the Bible, rather than accepting by faith. And some fall prey to Satan's lies. Satan tries to deceive the world about God and has attacked God's Holy word. Sometimes man is influenced by Satan's lies and repeats them to others. Some do it intentionally, like evil atheists (who also take candy from babies), and some do it because they are deceived (like liberal so-called Christians.) I hope this clears this up. [/fundiehat]

04-16-2003, 12:45 AM	#38
Badfish Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Death Valley, CA Posts: 1,738	Sounds pretty close Frood.

04-16-2003, 08:30 AM	#40
Jack the Bodiless Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: UK Posts: 5,815	What about the censorship in the KJV? Examples: translating Leviathan's giant penis as a "tail" and referring to a woman's uterus as her "thigh". Of course, we have barely scratched the surface of the great mass of Biblical errors and contradictions yet. The main reason for not believing the Bible to be inerrant is because it is not inerrant, regardless of what certain verses say.

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