Freethought & Rationalism Archive

FunkyRes · 10-22-2002, 01:55 PM

As someone else just posted- the limestone used geologically links it to Jerusalem.

Sure- you could argue the bone box was made in Jerusalem but used in Galilee- but you would need to demonstrate that that kind of trade went on (bone boxes from other places that have Jerusalem type limestone, for example ...)

Vorkosigan · 10-22-2002, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Radorth:
Vork

It's another conspiracy.

Please list a few relics which actually date from the first century and are proven frauds. I've never heard of any.

Radorth

You must have misread, a not uncommon failing among apologists. I never said "first century."

Vorkosigan · 10-22-2002, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Layman:


Is this a change in position from your early proclamation that "it is most likely a fake" or are you going to somehow reconcile the two comments?

[ October 22, 2002: Message edited by: Layman ]

There is no contradiction. Think about it.

Liquidrage · 10-22-2002, 02:00 PM

Also, the limestone from which the box was made indisputable came from a quarry in Jerusalem

Seeing as how thats where it was sold I don't think anyone was expecting to find a "Made in China" label on the underneath.

However, the obvious reason it is newsworthy is because of the connection to the Xian Jesus.
You can't deny this is what is being put forth. It's why it's on every major US news site.

But the evidence for that connection doesn't exist right now. No one has to deny it or provide evidence to debunk it.

However, for those of us that do not revel in sensationalism, we have every right to

at the attention it is getting and the speculation some very poorly and decitfull stories are leading to.

Vorkosigan · 10-22-2002, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Radorth:


Ah, so there was no "first century relic production phase."

I never said it wasn't a forgery. I don't know and it's not like I need to develop hasty theories about it to keep MY world-view intact. I was commenting on Vork's latest conspiracy theory which, it now appears, is completely unsupported.

Thanks for the help.

Rad

[ October 22, 2002: Message edited by: Radorth ]

Don't worry about it Radorth. We all know you have a reading comprehension problem.

Vorkosigan

godfry n. glad · 10-22-2002, 02:02 PM

Layman did ask:

Quote:

Do you have any evidence that such ossuaries have been recovered from places like Galilee?

I'm not quite sure what you mean by "places like Galilee", but I'm going to assume that you mean "away from Jerusalem".

That being the case, I remember visiting an archeological site midway between Ashqelon and Qiryat Gat, on the coastal plain 70 to 80 miles southwest of Jerusalem, that had an entire underground community hewn out of limestone, including olive presses, residences and tombs. The information provided there, if I remember correctly, indicated that the community was constructed and inhabited by Hellenistic Jews during the 2nd and 3rd centuries CE and that ossuaries from that period were recovered and turned over to the Israel Antiquities Authority (which contradicts the claims in the article that the practice ended in 70 CE).

Now, that's been over five years and my memory is not the best, but I do clearly remember the archeological guide stating that ossuaries had been recovered from such communities _all_over_ what had been Judea.

godfry n. glad

FunkyRes · 10-22-2002, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Steve Locks:


There was a similar story a few years ago.

A quick websearch brought this up:

<a href="http://orion.mscc.huji.ac.il/orion/archives/1996a/msg00155.html" target="_blank">http://orion.mscc.huji.ac.il/orion/archives/1996a/msg00155.html</a>

Nice link-

Quote:

The caskets bear the names Jesus, son of Joseph, Mary, Joseph, Yehuda son of Jesus, Matthew and Mary.

That should be enough to dispell it.
The Jesus of the NT did not have kids.

FunkyRes · 10-22-2002, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Liquidrage:
However, for those of us that do not revel in sensationalism, we have every right to

at the attention it is getting and the speculation some very poorly and decitfull stories are leading to.[/QB]

Yeah- I know EXACTLY what you mean.
In their desire to be wise, they make themselves fools.

MortalWombat · 10-22-2002, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by FunkyRes:
As someone else just posted- the limestone used geologically links it to Jerusalem.

The only thing I have read about the nature of the ossuary is that it is made of Jerusalem Limestone, which I believe is found throughout the region. Where exactly does it say it came specifically from a quarry in Jerusalem?

Egoinos · 10-22-2002, 02:11 PM

Well, I don't know about anyone else, but I'm going to reserve judgment on this one until I a) get a copy of BAR and b) the academic community has a better chance of criticising/supporting the find in the various academic journals which exist on this topic.

Until we know more about it than the mainline press are giving, it seems a little hasty to rush in and say that its true or false, to be honest.

--Egoinos--

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10-22-2002, 01:55 PM	#161
FunkyRes Regular Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Antioch, CA Posts: 173	As someone else just posted- the limestone used geologically links it to Jerusalem. Sure- you could argue the bone box was made in Jerusalem but used in Galilee- but you would need to demonstrate that that kind of trade went on (bone boxes from other places that have Jerusalem type limestone, for example ...)

10-22-2002, 02:00 PM	#164
Liquidrage Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Tallahassee Posts: 1,301	Also, the limestone from which the box was made indisputable came from a quarry in Jerusalem Seeing as how thats where it was sold I don't think anyone was expecting to find a "Made in China" label on the underneath. However, the obvious reason it is newsworthy is because of the connection to the Xian Jesus. You can't deny this is what is being put forth. It's why it's on every major US news site. But the evidence for that connection doesn't exist right now. No one has to deny it or provide evidence to debunk it. However, for those of us that do not revel in sensationalism, we have every right to at the attention it is getting and the speculation some very poorly and decitfull stories are leading to.

10-22-2002, 02:11 PM	#170
Egoinos Regular Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Edinburgh Posts: 423	Well, I don't know about anyone else, but I'm going to reserve judgment on this one until I a) get a copy of BAR and b) the academic community has a better chance of criticising/supporting the find in the various academic journals which exist on this topic. Until we know more about it than the mainline press are giving, it seems a little hasty to rush in and say that its true or false, to be honest. --Egoinos--

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