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Old 09-17-2002, 06:11 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hail_Isis:
<strong>If you impose atheist beliefs on a class, it's the same as imposing religious beliefs on a class. Like was said "Darwin Day" probably doesn't fit into that category unless you were outright telling people that creation is not true when they believe in creation.</strong>
Isis,

If you read my other posts, you would know that I do not intend to impose beliefs on any of my classes. I would not even mention it to them. I intend to hang any signs that I might hang entirely outside of classes- probably on days that I don't teach.

-Perchance.
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Old 09-18-2002, 01:40 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hail_Isis:
<strong>If you impose atheist beliefs on a class, it's the same as imposing religious beliefs on a class. Like was said "Darwin Day" probably doesn't fit into that category unless you were outright telling people that creation is not true when they believe in creation.</strong>
You are making a false comparison. A science class is not a place for religion. There are comparative religions classes that fit that bill. Explaining why creation is bunk is entirely appropriate, and in fact is a perfect lesson in logic fallacies and the explanatory power of the scientific method in a science class, as is teaching that UFOs and psychics talking to the dead are pure nonsense.

This is not a simple matter for partisan opinion. It is not only the overhwelming opinion of the vast majority of life scientists. It is the also law, as far as publicly funded schools are concerned. The Supreme Court has repeatedly and definitively ruled on this issue, that creationism is NOT a scientific theory but the deliberate promotion of a religious POV and may not (not just should not, but "may not") be taught in a publicly funded school.

Most private nonreligious insitutions of higher learning follow this policy as well. Any who do not should not be considered reputable scientific centers of learning.

Darwin Day is no more "teaching atheism" than "Galileo Day" or "Newton Day" or "Copernicus Day". This is another red herring that religious extremists use to put reasonable people on the defensive.

When I presented a school teacher in town with the legal rulings and official Dept. of Education policy regarding his illegal presentation of creation as an equally valid point of view (which he did in the first place, not because he was a believer but as a defensive move to prevent attacks by fundie parents), he wimped out altogether and decided not to teach evolution in the first place.

This is the kind of crap that we MUST stand up to. Turning the other cheek while an unscrupulous, Machiavellian opponent rips your lungs out is not a solution.

This is not an issue of atheism, it is an issue of science education and the comperhensive education of our young citizens. Dumbing down things any further, and the producers of the 700 Club might as well be writing our course curriculums.
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Old 09-18-2002, 02:20 PM   #33
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galiel,

My science (science for teachers) professor, told me that there are like 5 states that mandate equal time between creation and evolution in public schools. I know Louisiana and Georgia were two of them.
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Old 09-18-2002, 06:08 PM   #34
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Originally posted by stardust:
<strong>galiel,

My science (science for teachers) professor, told me that there are like 5 states that mandate equal time between creation and evolution in public schools. I know Louisiana and Georgia were two of them.</strong>
Even more relevant is the fact that the radical right(c) has strategically overrun the Texas curriculum board for the past couple of decades, and they have become emboldened in the past few years. As the second largest market, Texas has long dominated the textbook publishing industry, and has, in fact, been a battleground for and against science teaching for the past 50 years. (textbook publishers do not find it cost-effective to create different versions for different regions, so they create for the lowest denominator, Texas).

Today, ALL public school science textbooks, as well as history, politics and literature textbooks, have been stripped of anything that might prove controversial. They are white bread, vanilla, bland shadows of what science education should be today. They soft-pedal everything from the Big Bang to carbon-dating to the fossil record to genetics to issues of "original intent".

It is all part of the "Wedge Strategy". Note, this is not some kind of secret conspiracy theory. The radical right is very open about their goals, their plans to achieve them, and the tactical moves they make locally to have, over time and in aggregate, a national effect. And, in fact, they are merely using, effectively and deliberately and quite legally, the democratic system in order to achieve their goals, which are nothing less than changing the Constitutional foundations of America. Why some of us resist using the same democratic institutions for much more modest and conservative goal of protecting our Constitutional rights, I do not understand, but I am ultimately optimistic. Zealots tend to overreach, and there is a chance that we can wake people up and moblize them before it is too late.

The confluence of 9/11's assault by religious zealots, the "God Bless America" reactionary response in America, the scandal in the Catholic church, Bush's faith-based initiative, Ashcroft's puritanical hysteria, the nomination of increasingly radical federal judges, the presidential election scandal in Florida--which made more people aware of the power and significance of the Supreme Court, Newdow's efforts, and the Godless March, make this a great time for each of us to make our own personal statements of principle that, in aggregate, can make a difference.
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