Geoff Hudson

Does God sow bodies then? Sounds like we are being invaded by aliens!

Geoff

Mageth

This reminds me of a point Joseph Campbell made in a couple of books about the alleged physical resurrection and ascension into Heaven. It's not a very strong argument and is not particularly "scholarly" (Magus' "goddidit" argument can trump anything, after all). Note that I find this more amusing than particularly compelling.

If Jesus' resurrected body was a physical body of some sort, then Jesus in ascending to heaven would be constrained from exceeding the speed of light during his trip. As heaven doesn't appear to be in this physical universe, and the physical universe is inconceivably vast, Jesus would as of yet hardly begun his trip to heaven even traveling at the speed of light (in reality, travel is probably only possible at a fraction of the speed of light). If the universe is expanding at a speed greater than Jesus could travel, then he would never escape the universe and reach heaven.

The whole "ascension" bit is based on the Biblical writer's belief that the "universe" was a few tiered layers with the earth at bottom, the sun, moon, and stars at various domelike levels above, with Heaven on an uppermost level. The Tower of Babel and Stairs from Heaven with Angels Descending stories further illustrate that the writers thought that Heaven was somewhere right above us and was apparently easily reachable. Hence, it would make sense for the resurrected Jesus to ascend into heaven - it's right up there, after all.

Mageth

Originally posted by Magus:

Irreversible to whom? Humans may not be able to reverse the process, but its hardly a challenge for God.

Yeah, your god is a regular Dr. Frankenstein.

The Bible is a book full of monsters. You have Zombies such as Lazarus and Jesus, man-swallowing fishes, Leviathan, Behemoth, demons and devils, dragons, reanimated valleys of dry bones, and the symbolic vampirism of drinking blood, to mention a few.

thebeave

It's because of statements like this that Magus, in his mind, could never, ever lose a debate on these forums. I suggest we all just quit these forums permanently, shut off our PCs, go home, drink a beer and turn on Baywatch.

Mageth

Originally posted by Magus55
Um, Jesus wasn't buried in the ground, and He was only dead 3 days - doubt His body decomposed much. And second, God is omnipotent - He could take someones cremated ashes on the bottom of the pacific and restore them to a full body again.

Yeah, that's right; god's omnipotent. He could take a pile of cow dung, a set of Legos, or absolutely nothing at all and restore anyone to a full body if he wanted to.

Heck, he's so omnipotent he coulda come up with some other plan where there was no suffering and Jesus or anyone else didn't have to die for "sins", no one went to hell, and everyone lived happily ever after. Oh, wait; I forgot. He couldn't do that.

NOGO

Right! How about improbable?

My problem is this.
I find far less believable
that God needed the death of his Son in order to forgive mankind and that this act alone "saved" us all, provided that we believe ...
than
the fact that a man resurrected.

The absurdity of the former makes discussing the latter totally superfluous.

fried beef sandwich

That would probably also mean that Elijah is pretty much screwed too, although he's got a 2000-year head start on Jesus.

Doctor X

Yessss . . . "Big Daddy" can do anything . . . except get his son's birthdate correct. . . .

I generally do not like to "flame" a poster without cause--"Never throw the first stone, but when one is thrown, use a flame-thrower" I always say. However, Magus55 seems to represent a complete waste of effort. If someone is not willing to respond to direct questions, evaluate evidence, and otherwise stray from his preconceived notions that, unfortunately, are based on nothing but personal fantasy, he really contributes little to a debate forum . . . other than comic relief for more serious posters.

--J.D.

mark9950

Rofl I am rolling on the floor laughing.