Freethought & Rationalism Archive

emotional · 06-01-2003, 08:48 AM

It is beatiful, KitKit. The trouble with me is I'm feeling so down.

Perhaps the best attitude towards life and death is that which was summed up by Robert Green Ingersoll: live for now, for the world, and if there is an afterlife, it will probably be an afterlife of mercy and kind judgement, unlike what the Christians say.

If I trade this life for an imagined afterlife, I am no different than the 9/11 terrorists.

emotional · 06-01-2003, 09:14 AM

When my parents told me death is the end of all, the result was it had me in fits for the rest of my life. But at least I've learned a lesson from all this. I now declare agnosticism as to the question of life after death. When it's my turn to do the educating and my children ask me about death, I'll give the most honest answer: on death the body decomposes, and other than that we simply don't know. That will be reason satisfied, and faith an entry not denied.

KitKit · 06-01-2003, 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by emotional
It is beatiful, KitKit. The trouble with me is I'm feeling so down.

Perhaps the best attitude towards life and death is that which was summed up by Robert Green Ingersoll: live for now, for the world, and if there is an afterlife, it will probably be an afterlife of mercy and kind judgement, unlike what the Christians say.

If I trade this life for an imagined afterlife, I am no different than the 9/11 terrorists.

i completely agree. hang in there. things are bound to get better.

Goliath · 06-01-2003, 09:42 AM

emotional,

Quote:

If oblivion is the end result of all things, then life is pointless.

Incorrect. I do not believe in any kind of afterlife, and my life is not pointless.

Sincerely,

Goliath

Flavor · 06-01-2003, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by diana

False dichotomy. I think there could easily be a third option, something like: "I love you honey. Here are the keys to your new Mercedes." I'd fucking love to hear that.

Hahahaha <3.

Luiseach · 06-01-2003, 04:42 PM

I don't think my life is meaningless because it can't go on forever.

Enjoying a lovely day in the sun isn't pointless just because it has to end when it gets dark.

Walross · 06-02-2003, 01:26 AM

KitKit - wonderful posts - your children are beautiful...which is so much to the point. We all die. So far as anyone knows, our consciousness dies as well..but we do get to pass on certain traits. As I said earlier in this thread, my mother died three years ago, but I can see aspects of her in my 4 yr old nephew. It's almost magical. What more can I say beyond the fact that the most basic part of life is the fact that it ends? Is that so horrible?

(edited to add) I'm not so much addressing this to Kitkit (who I suspect I probably agree with), as to emotional. Regards,

Ross

KitKit · 06-02-2003, 04:12 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Walross
KitKit - wonderful posts - your children are beautiful

thank you very much! the middle one is my nephew actually. the 2 girls are mine. they are definitely keepers.

schu · 06-02-2003, 05:04 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by emotional
It's easy: you just switch reason off and let faith dominate.

Thanks emotional for expressing what I've always contended about the religious mindset. That is people have to abdicate their reason to accept religion. (The xian religion presupposes life after death.) You are honest about your faith.

Unfortunately most xians are dishonest and pretend there is objective reasoning behind their faith.

Does it give anyone pause that we have a person who has abdicated their reason with their finger on the nuclear button?

That may be the Biggest Problem for Atheism. That may bring on the oblivion of death, but do little to advance atheism for those of us who are dead.

Emotional is correct that there is no ultimate meaning in this life. But that very fact makes in important for individuals to make life meaningful. To make this into a world that Carl Sagan envisioned, a world of love and beauty.

emotional · 06-02-2003, 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by schu
Thanks emotional for expressing what I've always contended about the religious mindset. That is people have to abdicate their reason to accept religion. (The xian religion presupposes life after death.) You are honest about your faith.

My belief in life after death isn't entirely blind. It is based also on things which I interpret as evidence for life after death, such as NDEs and mediumship. Now before you all go the whole hog on me, as in the Science and Scepticism forums, I know NDEs are not conclusive evidence for life after death, I know the arguments for a naturalistic explanation of NDEs, I know all that stuff. But because I want to believe in life after death, I ignore those arguments and interpret NDEs as evidence for life after death.

If there were really no evidence at all (such as NDEs), then I wouldn't be able to believe, no matter how hard I tried. It'd be 100% pure self-delusion. I'm glad there are at my disposal some things I can interpret evidence for life after death. The trouble with evidence is that it can be refuted (as with NDEs). That's where faith comes in.

Faith and evidence are a feedback loop. Ever since the news of the SARS outbreak (which I had at first thought was as lethal as AIDS or ebola) I've immersed myself in Spiritualist literature to strengthen the evidential basis for my faith in life after death.

Quote:

from http://skepdic.com/spiritul.html (Skepdic's article about Spiritualism

For many, spiritualism was "scientific proof" of life after death, which didn't involve any of the superstitious non-sense of religion.

I don't want no miracles or any o' that Biblical stuff. All I want is an assurance of life after death.

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06-01-2003, 08:48 AM	#71
emotional Banned Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Boxing ring of HaShem, Jesus and Allah Posts: 1,945	It is beatiful, KitKit. The trouble with me is I'm feeling so down. Perhaps the best attitude towards life and death is that which was summed up by Robert Green Ingersoll: live for now, for the world, and if there is an afterlife, it will probably be an afterlife of mercy and kind judgement, unlike what the Christians say. If I trade this life for an imagined afterlife, I am no different than the 9/11 terrorists.

06-01-2003, 09:14 AM	#72
emotional Banned Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Boxing ring of HaShem, Jesus and Allah Posts: 1,945	When my parents told me death is the end of all, the result was it had me in fits for the rest of my life. But at least I've learned a lesson from all this. I now declare agnosticism as to the question of life after death. When it's my turn to do the educating and my children ask me about death, I'll give the most honest answer: on death the body decomposes, and other than that we simply don't know. That will be reason satisfied, and faith an entry not denied.

06-01-2003, 04:42 PM	#76
Luiseach Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: limbo Posts: 986	I don't think my life is meaningless because it can't go on forever. Enjoying a lovely day in the sun isn't pointless just because it has to end when it gets dark.

06-02-2003, 01:26 AM	#77
Walross Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Edmonton, AB, Canada Posts: 1,569	KitKit - wonderful posts - your children are beautiful...which is so much to the point. We all die. So far as anyone knows, our consciousness dies as well..but we do get to pass on certain traits. As I said earlier in this thread, my mother died three years ago, but I can see aspects of her in my 4 yr old nephew. It's almost magical. What more can I say beyond the fact that the most basic part of life is the fact that it ends? Is that so horrible? (edited to add) I'm not so much addressing this to Kitkit (who I suspect I probably agree with), as to emotional. Regards, Ross

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