Freethought & Rationalism Archive

SLD · 03-15-2003, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JonathanChance
Here is what I have so far.

I think it looks good. Feel free to add yor suggestions. I'd like to keep it under 300 words, and I have 263 in this letter, according to Microsoft Word.

Uhhmmm one thing - no ad hominem attacks. Yes he's a fool, but the paper won't print it if you say it. They may not print any of it.

SLDER

crazyfingers · 03-15-2003, 04:16 PM

Nce reply. You really should mention that it's the same letter that's being copied to other newspapers. Newspapers do not like to be fooled this way and the right wing has been doing this recently. The last one that I'm aware of was one praising Bush for his leadership.

Zachar · 03-15-2003, 04:29 PM

Some grammar nitpicks...

Quote:

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dear Editor:
...
For example, There is no such Supreme Court case as Reed v. Van Hoven. Despain v. Dekalb County, the case in which Mr. Pape claims the the Supreme Court forbade students from saying grace before eating lunch does not exist either.

Decapitalize "There".

Quote:

The Despain case, which was from the Seventh Circuit court, and never reached the supreme court dealt with a forced prayer, not a voluntary one.

The Despain case, from the Seventh Circuit court and not the Supreme Court, dealt with a forced prayer, not a voluntary one.

I also agree with SLD. Don't call Pape a liar or a fool (even though he is both and is also a tard). Simply point out that he is mistaken.

JonathanChance · 03-16-2003, 12:07 AM

Here's the second draft:

Quote:

Dear Editor:

Mr. Dennis Pape�s letter of 14 March 2003 is full of complete and utter misinformation. The Supreme Court has never ruled that a child cannot pray in a public school on an individual basis. To say that the Supreme Court has done so is untrue. For example, there is no such Supreme Court case as Reed v. Van Hoven. Despain v. Dekalb County, the case in which Mr. Pape claims that the Supreme Court forbade students from saying grace before eating lunch does not exist either. In fact, the Supreme Court has never even taken up the subject of prayer before lunch in a public school setting.

After a bit of research, I found out that Mr. Pape has grossly distorted the facts in a number of the cases he cites. The Despain case, from the Seventh Circuit court and not the Supreme Court, dealt with a forced prayer, not a voluntary one. The Reed case was nothing more than the opinion of a District court judge in 1965 that said that after school use of classrooms for religious purposes was a violation of the Establishment clause, and therefore unconstitutional. This case was renderd null and void by later Supreme Court decisions.

Many of the other cases cited by Mr. Pape are also either bogus cases or serious distortions of what the cases were really about. I have seen many letters like the one Mr. Pape submitted. All of them state that Christians are horribly persecuted in this country. Yet, a simple checking of even just a few of the "facts" in these e-mails show them to be in error. And yet they get passed on as though they were factual. I would think the Bible would have something to say about bearing false witness...

Sincerely,

James M. Wendler

... · 03-18-2003, 10:14 AM

So what happened? Did the letter get printed?

lpetrich · 03-18-2003, 11:49 AM

I've read George Washington's Farewell Address; there are online copies of it in various places.

He viewed religion as something useful for making people virtuous; a logical consequence of this view is that a religion useful for that purpose need not be true. Plato made that inference in his Republic, proposing that his ideal city have an official religion that he called a "royal lie", a religion which was designed to demonstrate the legitimacy of that city's rulers.

Interestingly, GW was also opposed to a big national debt and foreign entanglements.

JonathanChance · 03-18-2003, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ...
So what happened? Did the letter get printed?

Well, I sent it out in the mail yesterday, and they must have recieved the letter at around noon CST, because the paper called me to confirm that I was the one who sent in the letter. She didn't say anything after that. The last time that i had a letter to the editor accepted in a different newspaper on an unrelated subject, they told me that they were going to print it and when I should expect to see it. So, I suppose that the possibility exists that my letter will not get printed. Now I play the waiting game.

JonathanChance · 03-24-2003, 09:54 PM

Linky:

My letter to the editor.

beekay · 03-25-2003, 03:23 AM

Congratulations! Well done. Keep an eye out for any responses; it would be very interesting to watch the original letter being somehow defended.

I love that last line about false witnesses. Nice touch!

keyser_soze · 03-25-2003, 04:31 AM

Perhaps we should have a recurring thread where we post such crap and then the board can help to create and edit the letter before submission?

03-24-2003, 09:54 PM	#18
JonathanChance Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Stevens Point, WI Posts: 538	IT GOT PRINTIED!!!!!!!!! Linky: My letter to the editor.

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03-15-2003, 04:16 PM	#12
crazyfingers Contributor Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Massachusetts, USA Posts: 13,699	Nce reply. You really should mention that it's the same letter that's being copied to other newspapers. Newspapers do not like to be fooled this way and the right wing has been doing this recently. The last one that I'm aware of was one praising Bush for his leadership.

03-18-2003, 10:14 AM	#15
... Regular Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: United States Posts: 229	So what happened? Did the letter get printed?

03-18-2003, 11:49 AM	#16
lpetrich Contributor Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Lebanon, OR, USA Posts: 16,829	I've read George Washington's Farewell Address; there are online copies of it in various places. He viewed religion as something useful for making people virtuous; a logical consequence of this view is that a religion useful for that purpose need not be true. Plato made that inference in his Republic, proposing that his ideal city have an official religion that he called a "royal lie", a religion which was designed to demonstrate the legitimacy of that city's rulers. Interestingly, GW was also opposed to a big national debt and foreign entanglements.

03-25-2003, 03:23 AM	#19
beekay Regular Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Western North Carolina Posts: 121	Congratulations! Well done. Keep an eye out for any responses; it would be very interesting to watch the original letter being somehow defended. I love that last line about false witnesses. Nice touch!

03-25-2003, 04:31 AM	#20
keyser_soze Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: god's judge (pariah) Posts: 1,281	Perhaps we should have a recurring thread where we post such crap and then the board can help to create and edit the letter before submission?

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