Darth Dane

Offering the unknown and unprovable in explantion of the same is just a little disingenuous don't you think?

As I see it, when a person comes to me, and say "God is", I am left stranded with the question, "what is God"
If the answer is based on belief and hearsay, then that person is using teh unprovable and unknwon as an explanation.




DD - Love Spliff

Godot

All that is in this glass of yours is what I refer to as "conciousness." No epistomological or metaphysical explanations are needed.

Goliath

Darth Dane,

And I've asked you what a soul is. Also, you have not proven your assertion that it is impossible to prove whether or not a soul (whatever that is) exists.

That's your problem, not mine. I'm not the one that's asserting that souls exist, remember?

Wrong. The people who wrote the bible saw a connection. However, why is the existence of a god necessary for the existence of a soul (again, whatever that is)?

Again, this is an unproven assertion.

Whoopty, doo! If an angel moved my fingers on the keyboard, then it would still be me typing this message!

I am the sum total of the parts of my body. Again, why are you asking such inane, pointless, easy to answer questions?

Sincerely,

Goliath

Edited to say: I'm going to grab some sleep now. Good night.

Darth Dane

All that is in this glass of yours is what I refer to as "conciousness."

This begs the question "what is conciousness?"

AFAIK the modern science still haven't figured out this business of conciousness.




DD - Love Spliff

Darth Dane

And I've asked you what a soul is. Also, you have not proven your assertion that it is impossible to prove whether or not a soul (whatever that is) exists.

Ok, I don't know what a soul is. Maybe you do! If you know there is a soul what is it?

If you don't know what a soul is or don't believe in the concept of "soul", then what is in me?


That's your problem, not mine. I'm not the one that's asserting that souls exist, remember?

I never said souls exist, read what I write. Since one man(probably more) has asserted that the soul exist, then I ask what is the soul, since I cannot see it?
You may say that the concept of "soul" is just an idea in someones head, and thus not real.
Then I ask how do you know the soul is not real, and just an idea in someones imagination. if noone can prove it?


How can we disprove what we cannot prove?

Wrong. The people who wrote the bible saw a connection. However, why is the existence of a god necessary for the existence of a soul (again, whatever that is)?

I never said that there had to be a connection, I can't see a connection, but someone claims that they can!


Whoopty, doo! If an angel moved my fingers on the keyboard, then it would still be me typing this message!

Yes, it would ne you, but if an angel directs you, you cannot see it can you?


I am the sum total of the parts of my body. Again, why are you asking such inane, pointless, easy to answer questions?

Imagine this is "God" talking. God's body is the universe, and all contained within the universe, are all the parts that God is comprised of. This also means you and me.
Imagine we on earth are the "heart" of the universe, then we don't treat our heart very well.
We are like a virus that keeps reproducing until the host is dead, in this case, earth.


Is this a good story?
My imagination stretches far





DD - Love Spliff

Godot

You're right. They haven't. Just thought I'd throw out a naturalistic red herring for the hell of it. Besides, the whole concept of a soul complicates matters somewhat, doesn't it?

Eudaimonist

You are not empty if your brain is not empty. You are a conscious biological entity with a sense of self.

Starboy

Such a deceptive argument, let's look at your presumptions:

1) The “me” and the “soul” are one and the same.
2) A “soul” or “spirit” needs a container.
3) The "me" or “soul” is not a part of the body but is only contained by it.

If you assume what you are trying to show then you are not arguing but engaging in trickery and deception. You need to sneak these presumptions in because if you did not it would be impossible for anyone to take your argument seriously. This is because you will also claim:

- The soul can exist without a container and will spend the vast amount of its existence, "eternity", without a container.

In addition the evidence from our existence is that when someone dies their "me" is lost forever. That in fact we can chop off or destroy just about every part of the body except the brain and the "me" remains, but destroy or sufficiently damage the brain and the "me" is lost. So the vessel of the "me" does not appear to be the body but the brain. Additionally we can interrupt or change the biochemical processes in the brain and change a person’s “me”. We can erase memories, insert false memories, change likes and dislikes, in short make someone very different from their old “me”. However in the first century the local vocal yokels didn't know this. They could in all honesty claim ignorance.

Now it is difficult for me to think that you are unaware of all this, so my only conclusion is that you are a lying, deceiving sack of you know what.

Starboy

Infidelettante

If I am empty, ie. no soul, just my brain computing away, then who is in me?
If there is nothing in the glass, what is the glass?

Jesus said: If the flesh came into existence because of the spirit, it is a marvel. But if the spirit (came into existence) because of the body, it is a marvel of marvels. But as for me, I wonder at this, how this great wealth made its home in this poverty.

If there is something in the glass, what is in it?

DD - Love Spliff

DD, there is a way of speaking of soul that avoids this problem [though it no doubt creates others]. There is one soul and the one soul does not dwell in the body rather the body swims in the one soul. The body dwells in the soul and is the expression of it. All things are the expression of the one soul which I call the Divine. The body and the soul are not independent entities. Think of the body as the material universe and the soul as the Divine. The soul/body question is one of a Cosmic nature. It points us to the structure of the universe rather than the structure of the individual.

I think this way of thinking also avoids the Christian/Gnostic distrust of the body which is the point of your quote. The soul and body, Divine and Matter can't be at odds as they are one and the same.

As to who you are, and where you are, and what you are, you are on your own on that one. I'm having enough trouble with who I am.

JT

emotional

It's the perennial question of self-conscious humankind:

Why am I me? How am I become a thinking, conscious being? How is it that I am in the driver's seat? Why am I this person and not the other? Why am I a human and not an insect?

Although I believe in souls, I admit that saying "because of the soul" doesn't answer the question any more than the materialistic theory does. It's a real mystery, this one.