Krieger

Nah, I already did the far-right/conservative thing (I was a Rush Limbaugh fan - I even used to watch his TV show) for like six years - until Bush got elected. Then I realized I had been supporting the wrong people, hehe.

Grad Student Humanist

Maybe not according to your standards, but I consider the following countries examples of democracy: the US, Canada, Costa Rica, Chile, Australia, New Zealand, India, France, Germany, Switzerland, Italy, Austria, the UK, the Scandinavian countries, Spain, and the Netherlands among many others.

August Spies

Those aren't democracies, they are republics. You can define the two words as the same thing if you wish, I guess, but that gets us nowhere but confusion. Our founding fathers hated the idea of democracy and railed against it quite often.

moon

The question is not well-posed. It is not a question of which system you support, but whose side are you on?

There are lot of words thrown around like "democracy" and "republic," but the most important question has not been addressed at all, which is the class question. Democracy? Democracy for whom? For which class? Since the state only exists to the extent there are irreconcilable class antagonisms, there can be democracy only for the ruling class until states and classes are done away with.

beyelzu

course, he didnt say democracy, he said democratic which I believe means certain things, like free elections, freedom of speech, relgion, press. restrictions on governmental powers, the right to have guns so you can shoot the commies when they try to take over the government. you know basic human rights and voting. which is how the word "democratic" is often used today.


4 entries found for democracy.
To select an entry, click on it.
democracypure democracysocial democracyTory Democracy

Main Entry: de�moc�ra�cy
Pronunciation: di-'m�-kr&-sE
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural -cies
Etymology: Middle French democratie, from Late Latin democratia, from Greek dEmokratia, from dEmos + -kratia -cracy
Date: 1576
1 a : government by the people; especially : rule of the majority b : a government in which the supreme power is vested in the people and exercised by them directly or indirectly through a system of representation usually involving periodically held free elections
2 : a political unit that has a democratic government
3 capitalized : the principles and policies of the Democratic party in the U.S.
4 : the common people especially when constituting the source of political authority
5 : the absence of hereditary or arbitrary class distinctions or privileges


check number one b which would apply to how he used the term.

beyelzu

moon,

in the history of the world, I dont think that there has ever been a country that hasnt had a "state" That's like having water that isnt wet.

moon

This applies to none of the states mentioned by the "humanist."

moon

I see you are still having capitalization problems.

The question is, What is a state? I realize that you are not a Marxist, and your definition may differ from mine, but the state is a power that comes from society, yet places itself above society, that has a monopoly on the legitimate use of violence, which is carried out by special bodies of armed men who have at their disposal prisons, etc.

In this sense, the state has only existed exactly to the extent that there have been objectively irreconcilable class antagonisms. The state therefore is a special organization of force, for the suppression of one class by another. That is, it exists to enforce the dictatorship of one class over the others. To speak of "democracy" while states still exist is nonsensical. We can only ask about "democracy" for which class?

August Spies

haha.... what? 99.9 percent of human existance was without any kind of state.... unless you are defining country as something that has a state, which isn't very useful.

Beyelzu :
id also agree with moon that its quite a strecth to say all those countries let the people have supreme power, quite a stretch indeed.

David M. Payne

For me as a capitalist, (EDC variety) it would have to have the same things we have here politically, socially and economically, and be evolving into a better system for most of the people. Of course it would be de-facto capitalism then, but you could call it communism, and I would be fine with that.

David

"God, Marx, and religion, the oldest scam(s) in history, and they still suck them in today. So free your mind, and your body will follow!