Roland98

OK--I'm running out of rabbits to pull out of my hat, and I'm too damn stubborn to drop it. There's a fundie kid (well, I think he's 18) on another site I post on that is all about showing everyone how Satan influences music. He's particularly concerned with Eminem, Ozzy, and Marilyn Manson. So I and others have pointed out lyrics that contradict his idea that they're even Satanists at all (or that their lyrics contain "Satanic themes," as he's now amended his argument.) Scientific studies have been cited, I've pointed out many cases where the one site he uses to get most of his info from was blatantly lying (goodfight.org--go there for a good laugh), I've had him running in circles trying to define what exactly constitutes a "Satanic theme," I've then pointed out Christian bands that have songs that cover these same "themes," and he always comes back with some irritating "Jesus loves you, these artists are of the devil, as I've shown you " remark. And it really pisses me off. He's just like a creationist in the way he debates--and though I don't have any illusions about ever changing his mind, I'm looking for suggestions on either 1) some more sites that may address this Satanic BS, or 2) a good way to gracefully exit without losing face. I'd hate to let the fundie brat think he "won" just because I can't stomach anymore of his shit.

Any suggestions?

I ate Pascal's Wafer

My, you're bitter. I've been following your discussion with him, and I feel for ya.

I wish I had some good advice for you. Sometimes the best we can do is throw out some logical (and sometimes emotional) arguments and hope it does him some good. He has amended his arguments, and if I recall he at least admitted that goodfight isn't perfect all the time (even though he still clings to them).

If you are really tired of dealing with him, the only thing I can really suggest is to drop from the conversation. Tell him that you have said all you can say about the subject, and that you still stand by your assertions, and leave it at that. I haven't found a really graceful way to leave a discussion yet. Normally I try to make the other person drop the subject, but from time to time you run into someone more stubborn than yourself.

Failing that, we can always recruit volunteers to overwhelm him logic.

Hope this helps...

-Nick

Roland98

Thanks Nick. I don't think he can be "overwhelmed" with logic--since most of my "logical" posts he simply ignores and makes some Jesus quote. (But hey, if there are any takers... ) I thought he'd shut up when I pulled out the big guns and pointed out how Jesus referred to himself as "son of man;" so, shouldn't that mean he wasn't God? Of course, no reply to that one. I probably will drop it shortly--I'd just rather go out with a bang than a fizzle.

livius drusus

Hi Roland -

I'm kind of torn between moving this thread to GRD or M&PC. Debating fundies is more of a GRD thing, but the Satanic music canard might be better dealt with in M&PC. Based on the approach of your OP, I'm leaning towards the latter. Got a preference?

Roland98

Either is fine with me. Since there's not a music folder per se , I thought I'd start it here and look for nibbles.

ju'iblex

Then I'll concur on media, and off we go!

j-ogenes

I'd just quit talking to him. Who cares if he thinks he "wins." Why do you need a "graceful" exit. It's not about winning or saving face.

j-ogenes

I'd just quit talking to him. Who cares if he thinks he "wins." Why do you need a "graceful" exit?

Lynn of the Prairie

I generally try to stay in it until it dies a natural death. I try to not let some things go unchallenged for benefit of the larger audience. It often stops them cold when you say something like, "well, I'm not a fundamentalist" because that signifies you won't argue on their terms. It's easy to find an opening to use that usually.

August Spies

uh? I think you shoudl just play the kid some Agorphobic Nosebleed, Pig Destroyer (I think they have a song called "cum in god's eye"), Deicide or Necrolytic and then he will think those bands are angels.

or some godflesh, or godstomper... the list just goes on.