Freethought & Rationalism Archive

MarcoPolo · 07-19-2002, 07:10 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by WinAce:
Yet another problem is historical precedent--whenever we've had enough data to make a definite conclusion, it's always been a natural one. When we've appealed to the supernatural before, we've been universally dissapointed later. We can therefore safely conclude that if there are supernatural forces somewhere, they leave the universe to operate purely according to a set of natural laws, some of which are obviously still unknown, and our universe is therefore, for all intents and purposes, identical to one where no supernaturalism is present.

Great thinking! This sums up something I think I believe.

Everything that happens has always had a NATURAL explanation.

Starboy · 07-19-2002, 07:37 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Caverdude:
HATS OFF TO STARBOY.
That was beautifully stated. You echo my thinking exactly. There should not be any conflict between religion and science. They are two different non-overlapping diciplines.

It's seems that there shouldn't be, but how do you explain the last 400 years of crap being shoveled by Christians?

Starboy

GeoTheo · 07-19-2002, 07:48 AM

They were following an elephant. But seriously
Starboy I liked that long post you made about the supernatural etc.

Jayhawker Soule · 07-19-2002, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Caverdude:
There should not be any conflict between religion and science. They are two different non-overlapping diciplines.

What is the "discipline" of religion? The only consequence to non-overlapping domains apparent to me is that the God-of-the-Gaps serves as lord over an exponentially shrinking territory.

Starboy · 07-19-2002, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Starboy:


It's seems that there shouldn't be, but how do you explain the last 400 years of crap being shoveled by Christians?

Starboy

GeoTheo,

Present company excepted, I hope!

Starboy

Starboy · 07-19-2002, 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ReasonableDoubt:

What is the "discipline" of religion? The only consequence to non-overlapping domains apparent to me is that the God-of-the-Gaps serves as lord over an exponentially shrinking territory.

ReasonableDoubt,

I can't say as I understand it myself, but there are people (I used to be married to one), that truly believe that there is a supernatural world all around us and that it is possible for people to interact with it. You can't know how many hours, days, weeks, months, years I have spent arguing it, trying to understand it, trying to see it. From their point of view we just don't get it. From my point of view they don't get it. My only explanation is that they have an overactive imagination that has been directed from childhood to see, interpret and understand things as spirits, demons and gods. I would like to think that I have a very active imagination, but from my earliest years I have always been directed to understand things from a scientific point of view. My only argument to these people is that mankind has been thinking that way since forever, and only in the last few hundred years has this incredible new enterprise that is science, an enterprise that has never heretofore been seen by mankind come on the scene. In that short time it has demonstrated to be THE MOST SUCCESSFUL HUMAN ENDEVOUR FOR UNDERSTANDING OUR SURROUNDINGS IN THE HISTORY OF MANKIND. As you may have guessed by now, I really like saying that.

Starboy

Skeptical · 07-19-2002, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Starboy:


ReasonableDoubt,

I can't say as I understand it myself, but there are people (I used to be married to one), that truly believe that there is a supernatural world all around us and that it is possible for people to interact with it. You can't know how many hours, days, weeks, months, years I have spent arguing it, trying to understand it, trying to see it. From their point of view we just don't get it. From my point of view they don't get it. My only explanation is that they have an overactive imagination that has been directed from childhood to see, interpret and understand things as spirits, demons and gods. I would like to think that I have a very active imagination, but from my earliest years I have always been directed to understand things from a scientific point of view. My only argument to these people is that mankind has been thinking that way since forever, and only in the last few hundred years has this incredible new enterprise that is science, an enterprise that has never heretofore been seen by mankind come on the scene. In that short time it has demonstrated to be THE MOST SUCCESSFUL HUMAN ENDEVOUR FOR UNDERSTANDING OUR SURROUNDINGS IN THE HISTORY OF MANKIND. As you may have guessed by now, I really like saying that.

Starboy

I am becoming more and more convinced that the people who truly believe the things you list about the supernatural may in fact have some sort of genetic predisposition to high levels of cognitive dissonance. All of the people I have met either in person or online can say in one breath that they believe in YEC and that demons control evil in the world, and then turn around and fly in airplanes, drive cars, use microwaves and in general take advantage of all of the technology that science has given the world.

At some level they accept science and take full advantage of it, and at another level they reject science and everything it stands for. It's such an odd mix of conflicting ideas that it truly borders on szchitzophrenia, and I don't think I'm exagerrating. I would say that they're just lying and they don't really believe the things they say, but they seem so sincere that I can only conclude that they do in fact believe this nonsense and have sucessfully split their consiousness right down the middle.

Some day we may understand this sort of mindset, but right now I really don't think we have a good explanation.

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07-19-2002, 07:48 AM	#63
GeoTheo Veteran Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Bemidji Posts: 1,197	They were following an elephant. But seriously Starboy I liked that long post you made about the supernatural etc.

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