Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Opus36 · 05-08-2003, 09:02 AM

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On the other hand, would you suggest we should rush all the dolphins, monkeys are other species near us on the evolutionary scale into emergency therapy due to their promiscuous sexual natures that has always include sexual behavior with their young? Without some angelic or moralistic explanation how would you account for the obvious discrepancy between the way you have been taught humans should behave sexually and the fact of how all the other species behave? Would you hold yourself and your all too temporary and clearly irrational views above the reality of billions upon billions of years of evolution? Silly question... Sure you would! You have to in order to rationalize and maintain what you have learned to believe.

Are you trying to say that because these animals have sex and reproduce with their young, that it justifies humans too? Because we are close on the evolutionary scale? I have see an 9 month old female dog go into heat. A 14 year old male dig under the fence to get to her. Now they were animals. But if they were humans that would be rape.

Dogs, Dolphins, Monkies...They are all smart animals. Humans are intelegent. So that is your differance. If an adult male forces a 14 year old gril into sex, he is an animal.

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I like many others did have a sexual experience with an adult when I was a child. If you would like to read the details you will have to go to my website the name of which I have promised not to reveal in my posts on this board.

Was that because you wanted to, or were you force into it. When I was a 15 year old boy I would have wanted to experiance sex with at 21 yearold woman. Not with a man. And I wouldnt have wanted any one photograping me while I was spanking my monky. When I was 12 years old, I knew nothing about sex.

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Children should have as much right to their sexuality as any of the rest of us even if it means we might have to concede the world is not flat.

Your right, they have the right to THEIR sexuality. We don't have the right to THEIR sexuality. If a child has questions about sex they should talk to their parents.

Fred · 05-08-2003, 10:32 AM

1: Abject and absolute fear.
2: Shame and guilt at being led astray and BLAMED for it by perpertrator..
3: Fear of all men.
4: Physical pain.
5: Inability to form relationships.
6: Isolation from others of same age group.
7: Nervous breakdowns occurring through life.
8: Living within the family atmosphere of confusion that exists after said event.
9: Lack of desire for sex due to many factors individual in nature (My sisters don't tell me this, I have another who keeps me informed as to their state)
10: Not being able to marry and raise a family due to the above.

That is just ten. There are many more.

I thank the moderators for posting advice and understanding my feelings. I do however disagree with their reasoning due to the first post. You may have murder threads, but I hope none that advocate it.
Somebody will be justifying the Minnows of Tiberius soon. Pathetic.

Loren Pechtel · 05-08-2003, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by emphryio
....well I can sort of see where Pat Kelly is coming from but I don't bother with quite that much free thinking nowadays.

I just like to know what is going on in the world. All of it, good and bad. It's kind of scary to think I could accidentally click on the wrong link and be off to jail as a pedophile. What a world.

Poor Pete Townsend.

He used a credit card. That was no accident.

Loren Pechtel · 05-08-2003, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ut
Would you care to explain? I honestly don't know how the US government is supposed to have been the largest supplier of child porn.

They "supply" it for sting operations. If you find a kiddie porn source advertized in the US it's almost certainly a government sting.

Paperstreet · 05-08-2003, 05:44 PM

First of all, if you LOOK at a video of a young child doing sexual things, then that shouldn't be illegal. If you are the one who videotaped it or made them do it, THAT should be illegal, because that is a terrible, horrible thing to do to an innocent child who can not make their own decisions.

People will say that having perverts look at that filth only encourages it. Well, if it stops them from going out and having to find a kid to do it with, then good.

Never will it make them want to go out and do it. They already wanted to when they looked it up. Thats like saying music makes you violent. Violent people listen to violent music, so of course there are going to be a few idiots who happen to remember there evil plots by listening to music.

What I'm saying there is, as long as you are innocently looking, or even aroused, it doesn't hurt anyone!!!! Does it hurt the kid? No. If you DO hurt a kid and force them into sexual situations then that should be punished very severely.

P. Kelly,
Harming children should be a crime, right? Sexually exploiting children IS harming them, whether you want to or not. Its different if someone 15 wants to have sex with a 25 year old women/man. Hell, if a hot 25 year old women wanted to have sex with me, I would jump at the oppurtunity. Now, a 10 year old, no matter how fast they are developing, doesnt want to have sex with someone much older then them. They probably aren't ready for something like that anyways. If a child, lets say, older then 14, wants to have sex and allows a video camera to tape it, then I see nothing wrong with it. No brainwashing is involved and both parties are willingly doing the act. But there is no way a child younger then that would want to; or realize enough whats going on, to willingly participate in pornography. They are being brainwashed into doing it, and chances are they will feel the pain later.

Child porn is wrong, but the law uses a broad brush stroke to deal with this. The penalty should deal with the people who harm the children, not the ones who are curious. Also, the government sting operations I hear about are just stupid. You shouldn't go out of your way to arrest and humiliate people who aren't hurting anyone.

Loren Pechtel · 05-08-2003, 09:41 PM

Originally posted by Paperstreet
First of all, if you LOOK at a video of a young child doing sexual things, then that shouldn't be illegal. If you are the one who videotaped it or made them do it, THAT should be illegal, because that is a terrible, horrible thing to do to an innocent child who can not make their own decisions.

I see the kiddie-porn laws as equivalent to the offense of receiving stolen property. However, that does not apply to the virtual stuff--which the SC has said is legal.
Justice probably has some other ideas about this, though--I doubt anyone would dare do it unless they were outside the country.

People will say that having perverts look at that filth only encourages it. Well, if it stops them from going out and having to find a kid to do it with, then good.

That's how I see it, also. Adult porn reduces sex crimes, it's reasonable to expect kiddie porn to reduce kiddie sex crimes.

Never will it make them want to go out and do it. They already wanted to when they looked it up.

Exactly. One doesn't seek out fetish material unless it already is of interest.

If a child, lets say, older then 14, wants to have sex and allows a video camera to tape it, then I see nothing wrong with it.

I do. Sex is too complex for almost all 14 year olds.

Child porn is wrong, but the law uses a broad brush stroke to deal with this. The penalty should deal with the people who harm the children, not the ones who are curious. Also, the government sting operations I hear about are just stupid. You shouldn't go out of your way to arrest and humiliate people who aren't hurting anyone.

Yeah, the sting operations are totally out of line.

Ut · 05-09-2003, 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Loren Pechtel
They "supply" it for sting operations. If you find a kiddie porn source advertized in the US it's almost certainly a government sting.

Just when I thought I had found something to build a massive conspiracy theory on

yelyos · 05-12-2003, 09:26 PM

How far would I, as a 13 year old, have to go to break child pornography laws? Would I be in possession of child porn for having pictures of myself in solo sexual acts? Would it be unethical of me to possess photographs of myself?

Does the law even consider this possibility?

Just wondering.

yguy · 05-12-2003, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by yelyos
How far would I, as a 13 year old, have to go to break child pornography laws? Would I be in possession of child porn for having pictures of myself in solo sexual acts? Would it be unethical of me to possess photographs of myself?

Does the law even consider this possibility?

Just wondering.

Here's the easy solution: don't take any pictures of yourself waxing your weasel or whatever; or if you have, burn or shred them. I know it's a terrible hardship to be deprived of such valuable and worthwhile possessions...but people have survived even more egregious injustices than that, believe it or not.

yelyos · 05-12-2003, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by yguy
Here's the easy solution: don't take any pictures of yourself waxing your weasel or whatever; or if you have, burn or shred them. I know it's a terrible hardship to be deprived of such valuable and worthwhile possessions...but people have survived even more egregious injustices than that, believe it or not.

It was a purely hypothetical situation aimed at showing possible problems with the law.

Places where the law may go overboard.

I do not have any pictures of my penis.

05-08-2003, 10:32 AM	#52
Fred Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: N.S.W. Posts: 86	" One psychological harm" eh ? 1: Abject and absolute fear. 2: Shame and guilt at being led astray and BLAMED for it by perpertrator.. 3: Fear of all men. 4: Physical pain. 5: Inability to form relationships. 6: Isolation from others of same age group. 7: Nervous breakdowns occurring through life. 8: Living within the family atmosphere of confusion that exists after said event. 9: Lack of desire for sex due to many factors individual in nature (My sisters don't tell me this, I have another who keeps me informed as to their state) 10: Not being able to marry and raise a family due to the above. That is just ten. There are many more. I thank the moderators for posting advice and understanding my feelings. I do however disagree with their reasoning due to the first post. You may have murder threads, but I hope none that advocate it. Somebody will be justifying the Minnows of Tiberius soon. Pathetic.

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05-08-2003, 05:44 PM	#55
Paperstreet Regular Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Maryland Posts: 175	First of all, if you LOOK at a video of a young child doing sexual things, then that shouldn't be illegal. If you are the one who videotaped it or made them do it, THAT should be illegal, because that is a terrible, horrible thing to do to an innocent child who can not make their own decisions. People will say that having perverts look at that filth only encourages it. Well, if it stops them from going out and having to find a kid to do it with, then good. Never will it make them want to go out and do it. They already wanted to when they looked it up. Thats like saying music makes you violent. Violent people listen to violent music, so of course there are going to be a few idiots who happen to remember there evil plots by listening to music. What I'm saying there is, as long as you are innocently looking, or even aroused, it doesn't hurt anyone!!!! Does it hurt the kid? No. If you DO hurt a kid and force them into sexual situations then that should be punished very severely. P. Kelly, Harming children should be a crime, right? Sexually exploiting children IS harming them, whether you want to or not. Its different if someone 15 wants to have sex with a 25 year old women/man. Hell, if a hot 25 year old women wanted to have sex with me, I would jump at the oppurtunity. Now, a 10 year old, no matter how fast they are developing, doesnt want to have sex with someone much older then them. They probably aren't ready for something like that anyways. If a child, lets say, older then 14, wants to have sex and allows a video camera to tape it, then I see nothing wrong with it. No brainwashing is involved and both parties are willingly doing the act. But there is no way a child younger then that would want to; or realize enough whats going on, to willingly participate in pornography. They are being brainwashed into doing it, and chances are they will feel the pain later. Child porn is wrong, but the law uses a broad brush stroke to deal with this. The penalty should deal with the people who harm the children, not the ones who are curious. Also, the government sting operations I hear about are just stupid. You shouldn't go out of your way to arrest and humiliate people who aren't hurting anyone.

05-08-2003, 09:41 PM	#56
Loren Pechtel Obsessed Contributor Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Not Mayaned Posts: 96,752	Originally posted by Paperstreet First of all, if you LOOK at a video of a young child doing sexual things, then that shouldn't be illegal. If you are the one who videotaped it or made them do it, THAT should be illegal, because that is a terrible, horrible thing to do to an innocent child who can not make their own decisions. I see the kiddie-porn laws as equivalent to the offense of receiving stolen property. However, that does not apply to the virtual stuff--which the SC has said is legal. Justice probably has some other ideas about this, though--I doubt anyone would dare do it unless they were outside the country. People will say that having perverts look at that filth only encourages it. Well, if it stops them from going out and having to find a kid to do it with, then good. That's how I see it, also. Adult porn reduces sex crimes, it's reasonable to expect kiddie porn to reduce kiddie sex crimes. Never will it make them want to go out and do it. They already wanted to when they looked it up. Exactly. One doesn't seek out fetish material unless it already is of interest. If a child, lets say, older then 14, wants to have sex and allows a video camera to tape it, then I see nothing wrong with it. I do. Sex is too complex for almost all 14 year olds. Child porn is wrong, but the law uses a broad brush stroke to deal with this. The penalty should deal with the people who harm the children, not the ones who are curious. Also, the government sting operations I hear about are just stupid. You shouldn't go out of your way to arrest and humiliate people who aren't hurting anyone. Yeah, the sting operations are totally out of line.

05-12-2003, 09:26 PM	#58
yelyos Regular Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: northern suburbs of Toronto, Canada Posts: 401	How far would I, as a 13 year old, have to go to break child pornography laws? Would I be in possession of child porn for having pictures of myself in solo sexual acts? Would it be unethical of me to possess photographs of myself? Does the law even consider this possibility? Just wondering.

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