SignOfTheCross

I believe you declare yourself guilty.

Peace,
SOTC

sodium

Now, come on. Don't you really believe that leprechauns don't exist? If you were walking along one day, and saw a leprechaun at the end of a rainbow, sitting on his pot of gold, what would your reaction be? I don't think you'd think, "Oh well, I never had any real proof one way or the other on the existence of leprechauns. I guess they actually exist. I'm not particularly surprised, although I did think it possible that they might not exist."

I think instead, it would be the most surprising event of your life, and you would seriously question whether you were in fact still sane.

And this is my criticism of some who profess agnosticism, or weak atheism. A person who is perfectly willing to propound on such subjects as whether the earth is round, whether the moon-landing was faked, and even whether a budget deficit is good for the economy, suddenly takes an agnostic position on various philosophical and religious questions. Yes deficits will increase interest rates, but do leprechauns exist, well I just don't know. Yes the earth is vaguely spheroid, but is there a benevolent being directing the cosmos, I'd like to reserve judgment.

I don't even see why we need the word "agnosticism". I can't think of any other case where the "undecided" position in an argument is given its own name.

Mageth

Fortunately, what you believe has no relation to reality. I declare myself innocent. Or, rather, there is no crime to be tried for, thre will be no trial, and therefore there will be no verdict, declared by me or anyone else.

Now, instead of holding a wrong belief, you have the correct knowledge on how I stand in regards to my guilt or innocence.

(Damn, these theists are sure hung-up on the whole guilt thing, aren't they?)

SignOfTheCross

The word "you" was meant to be addressed in a broader sense, not "you" personally.

Should the Christian God exist, you would be to blame for your condemnation (should you be condemned). Who else is there to blame?

Peace,
SOTC

SignOfTheCross

I think you'll find most theists (whether Christian, Jew, Muslim, Hindu) have a conscious belief in God, not resulting from any mystical vision.

Peace,
SOTC

Inconnu

Is a baby born atheist?

HRG

You are even asking ? The omnipotent and omniscient being - if it exists - which knows perfectly well that the alleged evidence for its existence does not induce me to believe it, and, despite his alleged desire that all come to know him, refuses to present such sufficient evidence.

Of course, an omnipotent being has no problems providing this sufficient evidence.

Would you feel blameworthy if it turned out after all that Odin exists and asks you why you haven't trained for Ragnarök ?

Regards,
HRG.

Jack the Bodiless

I think it's rather interesting how some Christians react to the very existence of unbelievers.

Kneejerk reaction: fear, guilt, punishment. "You disobeyed, you are guilty, you will be punished, THE BOGEYMAN WILL GET YOU!!!".

No sign of that "God is love" propaganda. It gets straight to the point. God is the bully, the abusive parent, the ultimate Monster Under The Bed.

Jack the Bodiless

Then I hope you now see your error!

Our distaste for the word "denial" is twofold:

1. We wish to clarify that atheism does not require proof that no gods exist: we "deny" because of the lack of positive evidence for the existence of gods, NOT because we claim to have proof of their nonexistence. This is a VERY common misunderstanding, as we have seen.

2. We wish to address the wilful misunderstanding (actually, that's too gentle: "dissemination of lying propaganda" is more accurate) by certain Christians who are idiotic enough to believe that "atheists know that God exists, but are in rebellion against him" purely because the Bible says so. Even if we tell these morons that we do NOT know that God exists, they accuse US of lying about that.

contracycle

Yes