sweep

hello ps418, I was wondering if you have any studies on the effects of carbon monoxide to back up my claims. From 'what I know' and 'what I have experienced' I think and feel that carbon monoxide does cause permanent damage, which is central to the point of this thread, hey?

ps418

It could very well be that CO contributes to the "groggy and tired" feeling you describe. However, cigarette smokers probably consume far more CO than cannabis smokers, and there is to my knowledge no evidence that tobacco smoking impairs cognition in adults (there have been suggestion that it affects children's cogntive development). Further, the studies cited in this thread do not provide much support for permanent cognitive impairment due to cannabis use.

On the other hand, the "groggy and tired" feeling you describe could well be due to the type of cannabis you smoke, which have different cannabanoid profiles (i.e. level of cannabidinol). THC is not the only psychoactive cannabinoid in cannabis, and some of these have CNS depressant qualities. For instance, it has long been known that some strains, typically but not always sativas, produce a much more listless and groggy effect than the other strains, typically indica, despite the fact that both would probably produce the same amounts of CO upon combustion.

Patrick

scigirl

Hey Patrick,

I'm assuming you read those studies, and since I want to be lazy I have a question for you. How did they control for type and/or strength of the marijuana?

Thanks,

scigirl

scigirl

As to the negative effects of alcohol on society - I learned in embryology this year that fetal alcohol syndrome is the leading cause of mental retardation in the United States. Not sure what cannabis does to the fetus - does anyone know?

scigirl

sweep

very well informed. I'm surprised that you haven't mentioned the fact that Thc degrades. The more mature the plant, the heavier the feeling. I think this is because thc changes into cannabidiol as it degrades, but I'm a bit rusty on the old research.

what I have noticed ps418, and others is that, since I started eating hashish, the grogginess has gone away. I have attributed the grogginess to the vegetable matter that I used to ingest. I wonder if the vegetative matter has any properties that I am unaware of.

also, I notice after about two to three hours, after relatively high consumption of hashish, I do start to feel groggy. Not exactly the same feeling as smoking, but I attribute this feeling to nervous exhaustion. Why? because I feel numb and cannot focus well; this is mainly visual. Then, in order to get my brain working normally again, I have to take more cannabis. The high is then partially due to the fact that most of the time I'm feeling numb, and sometimes irritable.

Corwin

The referenced study, among several other recent ones.

Well if you want to talk medical instead of recreational... (wasn't specified earlier) then yes... quite true. It's also one of the major arguments for smoked/vaporized marijuana rather than marinol... (which has much the same problem as brownies.)

ps418

The ones I've seen did not control for the potency of the marijuana, since for the most part users can not tell you how potent (the % THC by weight) the marijuana they smoke is. Instead the ones I've read just use self-report of quantity smoked, i.e. a joint a week, a joint a day, two joints a day, etc, much the same way that many studies of alcohol just report number of drinks per day, where drink is understood to mean anything from a whole beer to a glass of wine to a small shot of puregrain alcohol.

Patrick

ps418

Well, those concerns apply for recreational users as well. Rereational users also want do not want to wait 2 hours for effects, want to be able to self-regulate their doses efectively, and usually want an effect that will not persist for 8-12 hours.

Patrick

Mageth

Let me switch into anal-retentive mode... (since we seem to be going down that path. Again.)

The damage caused by marijuana tends to be short term and recovery from it once use of marijuana ceases tends to be the norm.

What damage caused by marijuana? Be more specific, please. If marijuana destroys any brain cells (as alcohol does), they are not recoverable.

Recovery from the equivalent damage due to ingestion of alcohol tends to be permanent, however, said damage tends to be much less common, and is usually accompanied by other physical damage, most notably to the liver.

Are you saying that brain damage due to marijuana use is common, more common than brain damage due to alcohol use? Where do you get this information?

And if the "equivalent" damage is destruction of brain cells, then in both cases the damage is permanent. I don't know what "damage" you're referring to in regards to marijuana use, so I don't know if this is what you're talking about.

(You have to be a pretty committed hardcore drinker to achieve the same level of damage.)

Again, what damage? Define it.

Is that specific enough? Or should we start enclosing tissue samples in posts?

At least try to back up your assertions with some evidence. Where is the evidence for the "brain damage" caused by marijuana abuse? What exactly is this damage (what are the specific injuries to the brain caused by marijuana)?

At least give enough information for someone to know what the hell you're talking about.

Corwin

Gee, I don't know... maybe the damage referenced in the OP?

You seem to have this habit of expecting me to reinvent the damn wheel with every post, and recap all information that you should already be familiar with before jumping in.

RTFA.

The cells don't actually have to be destroyed for there to be damage.

Alcohol arguably DOES actually kill the cells, cannaboids apparently just impair them. The impairment eventually wears off.

By the way.... not ALL nerve damage is 'irreparable.' Just ask Christopher Reeve. Yes, I know conventional wisdom says that nerves never heal.... conventional wisdom has had to reevalutate that position, since some people have seen nerves heal. (Specifically, cases like Reeve regaining partial sensation and some extremely limited movement in his legs.)

Again... RTFA.