ageofreason2000

Sorry to post this shock value post, but I just linked to it from another thread and it seemed kinda relavent to the debate.

This is as good a reason as any to carry on Stem cell research, perhaps repairing the damage before any baby has to suffer the condition of Harlequin Ichthyosis.

Be warned before clicking on this it is extremely upsetting, I consider myself not easily shocked and I was physically shaken.
I think the origional post said "warning click on this only if you want to test your sanity"
(with apologies to those who have already seen)

<a href="http://www.ispub.com/ostia/index.php?xmlFilePath=journals/ijpn/vol2n1/harlequin.xml" target="_blank">http://www.ispub.com/ostia/index.php?xmlFilePath=journals/ijpn/vol2n1/harlequin.xml</a>

As a further aside this at least proves if their is a god, he is a Basterd (I suppose the god squad would counter ah but it is god who allows for such a condition to be very rare - Bollocks).

Get on with the research with all possible haste

Age (thought he had a strong stomach and just found this to not be the case)

[ November 27, 2002: Message edited by: ageofreason2000 ]</p>

winstonjen

ESPECIALLY Scripture! <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" /> <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" />

DigitalDruid

Those who think that soul enters a zygote at the moment of conception tie themselves into knots when asked to expalin what happens to soul when a zygote splits.

I am excerpting the relevant part from what I wrote in <a href="http://iidb.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic&f=57&t=000701" target="_blank"> another thread</a>:

"Directly borrowing Aristotle’s idea, influential Catholic theologian St. Thomas Aquinas declared that male fetuses are ensouled (get soul) at 40 days after conception, and female fetuses after 80 days. Accordingly those days the church did allow abortions in these early stages of a fetus. A point which many pro-life Catholics either are unaware of or ignore.

But now I think the official Catholic line is that the soul enters a zygote right at conception. Now this leads to some amusing scenarios as well. Medical science tells us that a zygote after say 15 days of conception can split into two identical twins. So what happens to the soul of the original zygote? Does it split too? Or does it die off? Probably not since Christian soul is supposed to be immortal! But splitting of soul is not biblical either. Not only that, since the original ensouled zygote is deemed to be a full-fledged ’person’, should we grieve her demise and at the same time celebrate the arrival of two new tiny ensouled beings (the twins)?"

[ November 27, 2002: Message edited by: DigitalDruid ]</p>

ageofreason2000

Edited because cross post

[ November 27, 2002: Message edited by: ageofreason2000 ]</p>

Boro Nut

This is a complete misnomer. They've been at it for donkey's years now.

Boro Nut

One of the last sane

OTOH, it is good to specify "embryonic" because otherwise its opponents start saying "fetal stem cell research" which is entirely misleading. The cells come from very, very early in the embryonic stage, not the fetal stage.

Boro Nut

It's not surprising I suppose. Would you volunteer if you knew it could be fetal?

Boro Nut

Shadownought

So let's see here...

God is willing to slaughter entire populations and allow unbelievable suffering and evil in the name of some Greater Good that no human can possibly understand...

But he's not willing to let us research stem cells in the name of curing horrible diseases?

Oh, I had forgotten- those diseases exist because they promote Yahweh's Greater Good, even though they disrupt the Free Will he supposedly holds above all else. Huh?

If you believe in the standard picture of Yahweh, then you have to admit that he put the stem cells there, and he put the information we need within them, and he knew that we would eventually begin to research them.

Either Yahweh was powerless to avoid it, or he wants us to research them... take your pick.

winstonjen

<img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" /> <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" /> <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" />

I agree. It would be much better for God to not create horrific diseases in the first place. I wish that the pope would get alzheimers, MND, or things like that. Then we would get theist approval quick smart.

They may say, "It's not God's fault, it's our fault for sinning!"

Well, who invented the concept of 'sin' in the first place? God, of course.