Freethought & Rationalism Archive

meritocrat · 05-12-2003, 03:28 AM

If he believed in freedom, he could he in good conscience own slaves?

Slave-owning may have been an accepted part of American society at the time, nevertheless it wasn't mandatory to own one. He had the ability to make an ethical stand against slavery.

RED DAVE · 05-12-2003, 03:35 AM

I can't believe we actually agree about something. Note, also, that TJ is one of the reigning gods of Libertarianism.

RED DAVE

lunachick · 05-12-2003, 03:37 AM

He was also into expansionism and/via genocide, wasn't he?

Corwin · 05-12-2003, 10:07 AM

Quote:

"Do not mistake me. I am not advocating slavery. I am not justifying the wrongs we have committed on a foreign people... On the contrary, there is nothing I would not sacrifice to a practicable plan of abolishing every vestige of this moral and political depravity." --Thomas Jefferson to Thomas Cooper, 1814. ME 14:184

Quote:

"It is material to observe that [slaves guilty of insurgency] are not felons, or common malefactors, but persons guilty of what the safety of society, under actual circumstances, obliges us to treat as a crime, but which their feelings may represent in a far different shape." --Thomas Jefferson to Rufus King, 1802. ME 10:327

Quote:

"I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just: that his justice cannot sleep forever: that considering numbers, nature and natural means only, a revolution of the wheel of fortune, an exchange of situation, is among possible events: that it may become probable by supernatural interference! The Almighty has no attribute which can take side with us in such a contest." --Thomas Jefferson: Notes on Virginia Q.XVIII, 1782. ME 2:227

Reading over Jefferson's own words, it becomes clear that he despised slavery. I know, I know... it's just so much fun to sling mud at American figures.... but there's that whole 'written historical fact' bit.

Jefferson was trapped in a system, and hated it. He was well known for treating his slaves unusually well, and freed them in his will. The system he lived in kept them in bondage against his express wishes.

I'm not defending the fact that he owned slaves. This isn't a good thing either. But let's give credit where credit was due.

lpetrich · 05-12-2003, 12:13 PM

He was a stagecoach liberal, it would seem.

(this was long before limousines became common)

Cicero · 05-12-2003, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by meritocrat
If he believed in freedom, he could he in good conscience own slaves?

Slave-owning may have been an accepted part of American society at the time, nevertheless it wasn't mandatory to own one. He had the ability to make an ethical stand against slavery.

Not true. His slaves, when the decalration of independence was written, were mortgaged to the hilt.

Interesting, the "new right" is even turning on the founding fathers.

meritocrat · 05-13-2003, 02:30 AM

How is conservatism related to this discussion?

05-12-2003, 03:28 AM	#1
meritocrat Banned Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: England Posts: 2,608	Thomas Jefferson - the classical liberal hypocrite If he believed in freedom, he could he in good conscience own slaves? Slave-owning may have been an accepted part of American society at the time, nevertheless it wasn't mandatory to own one. He had the ability to make an ethical stand against slavery.

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version	Search this Thread: Advanced Search

05-12-2003, 03:35 AM	#2
RED DAVE Banned Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: NYC Posts: 10,532	I can't believe we actually agree about something. Note, also, that TJ is one of the reigning gods of Libertarianism. RED DAVE

05-12-2003, 03:37 AM	#3
lunachick Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: NZ Posts: 7,895	He was also into expansionism and/via genocide, wasn't he?

05-12-2003, 12:13 PM	#5
lpetrich Contributor Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Lebanon, OR, USA Posts: 16,829	He was a stagecoach liberal, it would seem. (this was long before limousines became common)

05-13-2003, 02:30 AM	#7
meritocrat Banned Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: England Posts: 2,608	How is conservatism related to this discussion?

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.