Freethought & Rationalism Archive

10-11-2002, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by madmardigan:
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My thought is that once I can show that it would be impossible to know that god is omnimax, I can create a hypothetical situation where I can show God is not omnimax.

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How can you show anything if you don't know what Gods -omni qualities mean?

Omnipotent does require for God to life a rock upon which he was standing, nor does omnipresent mean that God must be all over at once because if he was there would be no room for you to be . . . and so on.

VirusInTheSystem · 10-14-2002, 01:24 PM

quote: 5. Our minds are finite. Meaning, there are some things which we can never understand, comprehend or be convinced of.

its kinda like those games for infants with the different shaped holes and plastic blocks: the baby has to put the blocks into the holes with the same shape, because the blocks won't fit in any of the other holes. Basically, our minds are one kind of hole, and the knowledge of God is a block of a different shape.

This, of course, is a mathematical impossibility.

One must either change the shape of the block to fit the hole, or change the shape of the hole to fit the block (in other words, "expand" our finite minds to be able to comprehend God).

But to fit a block into the wrong hole is similar to asking if God can create a "square circle" (another mathematical impossibility)

So can the Judeo-Christian God perform such complete condradictory feats? Can the Judeo-Christian God make "dark light" or "circular squares"? Can he put the infinate into the finite? Those are simply logical contradictions... a collision of terms.

So no, I don't think most believers in the Judeo-Christian realm would consider that to be possible.

peace

[ October 14, 2002: Message edited by: VirusInTheSystem ]</p>

Primal · 10-15-2002, 04:36 PM

Quote:

If our minds are finite/limited in such a way as to make it not possible for us to experience every possible example of omnipotence or omniscience (I'm assuming there's a time constraint here, as well) to thus prove god's omnipotence or omniscience, then how is it "logically possible" for god to perform the requested task? You're asking him to perform a logically impossible task, IMO. The limit is on our capabilities and not on god's.

Ah so God is limited by logic. Meaning maybe God isn't so all powerful afterall and theist claims are succeptible to logical analysis. I believe Aristotle would be happy with how the ones infinite God now has to aknowledge His limitations in the face of the Law of Identity. Meaning for starters that this Law existed without being created by God, this feature of existence always was without God. Hence God cannot be said to be the creator of all.

If anything this post would point to two facts 1) Since God is limited to the logically possible, He can no longer be described as infinite. 2) Since this is the case, it would not purely be a fault of man's that God unable to prove this or that, but a limitation of and hence a fault of God's as well.

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10-14-2002, 01:24 PM	#12
VirusInTheSystem Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Maryville, TN; U.S.A Posts: 30	quote: 5. Our minds are finite. Meaning, there are some things which we can never understand, comprehend or be convinced of. its kinda like those games for infants with the different shaped holes and plastic blocks: the baby has to put the blocks into the holes with the same shape, because the blocks won't fit in any of the other holes. Basically, our minds are one kind of hole, and the knowledge of God is a block of a different shape. This, of course, is a mathematical impossibility. One must either change the shape of the block to fit the hole, or change the shape of the hole to fit the block (in other words, "expand" our finite minds to be able to comprehend God). But to fit a block into the wrong hole is similar to asking if God can create a "square circle" (another mathematical impossibility) So can the Judeo-Christian God perform such complete condradictory feats? Can the Judeo-Christian God make "dark light" or "circular squares"? Can he put the infinate into the finite? Those are simply logical contradictions... a collision of terms. So no, I don't think most believers in the Judeo-Christian realm would consider that to be possible. peace [ October 14, 2002: Message edited by: VirusInTheSystem ]</p>

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