Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Wyz_sub10 · 12-17-2002, 06:13 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by idiom:
2 Corinthians 4:4 - In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

What's this suppose to mean relative to the OP? Bible quotes carry little weight, unless the subject has to do with meaning, content, history or interpetation of the bible, itself.

With regard to the OP, do you feel that a blind man can be convinced of the sun's existence although he could not see it? Would he require blind faith and nothing more?

[ December 17, 2002: Message edited by: Wyz_sub10 ]

Shadowy Man · 12-17-2002, 06:54 AM

As I mentioned before, Kent Cullers is a blind astronomer. He has been blind since birth. The blind astronomer in the movie Contact was based on him.

I am willing to bet a large sum of money that that blind man believes in sunlight though he has never seen it.

abe smith · 12-17-2002, 06:54 AM

(Wow, the great thing about this thread is that I can click out of it & walk away! Ain' modren technology wunnerful?)

Polar Bear · 12-17-2002, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by idiom:
2 Corinthians 4:4 - In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

You know, I have been an atheist for over ten years. And I frequent this board every now and then. I also get into religious debates on other boards. I never really questioned my beliefs ... until I saw this piece of Scripture. Yea, now the scales have fallen from mine eyes; I was as blind before, but now the Light is revealed to me! AMEN!!

idiom · 12-18-2002, 12:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by galiel:

Implying that there is some analogy with a skeptic, assumes that there is, in fact, a commonly agreed upon "god" that we all know exists but that skeptics are somehow mentally blocked from seeing.

That was the point of the scriptural reference.

Attacking the analogy assumes that the skeptic is not blinded. That was all.

12-18-2002, 03:58 PM

By Corgan

"HUH?!
earlier in Malaysian Politics at Political Discussions:

"My reply : It is the strong ones who made Malaysia as it is now, not weakenings. Yes, Earth is for those who deserve it - those who cherish its beauty and wonder about meaning of things and not ones who makes up theories and hide behind it."

Aren't you suppose to blame ourselves, inferior Malayans when the Portugese took over our shores? "

My reply : You're a Malaysian, right? I'm sure you are familiar with the history of Melaka and Perak and how the Resident of British came to be in those two states. You decide who to blame.

By galiel

"In sum: lighten up, read a little, learn a little, and don't be so sure you have already divined everything the universe has to teach you. And, if you wish to engage in rational discussion, learn the basic tools of the trade. "

My reply : Thank you for your advice. I have already bookmarked those site which I can open.

By Kharakov

"Some societies thrive on interaction with and introduction of foreign elements. Other societies are not strong or adaptable enough to handle foreign elements. "

My reply : Yes, true. Several countries managed to mingle in enough with the foreigners to bring some modern concepts into their country such as Japan, Thailand (a.k.a Siam at the time) and Egypt. Even in my country, Malaysia, a state called Johor (near Singapore) managed to stay the longest without a Resident installed into its government due to its clever local ruler till about 1907. But in the end, they also fall ... if it is not for internal factor, it is for external factor.

Butters · 12-19-2002, 04:47 PM

My reply: why am I still reading bullshit written by someone that STILL can't figure out the UBB code?

Toto · 12-19-2002, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by idiom:
2 Corinthians 4:4 - In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

What does this mean? Who is "the god of this world" who has blinded the minds of the unbeliever? I assume it is the Demiurge, or some lesser deity or demon, that no True Christian has believed in since the orthodox won out over the gnostics around the 4th century.

If you're going to quote scripture, couldn't you find something that makes sense? Okay, I take that back.

idiom · 12-20-2002, 03:59 AM

Concentrate this time...

Analogy is sound because:

Blind man cannot see the sun because he is blind.
Skeptic cannot comprehend the Bible because he is blind.

Quote:

What does this mean?

Quote:

If you're going to quote scripture, couldn't you find something that makes sense?

Case in point.

[ December 20, 2002: Message edited by: idiom ]

Wyz_sub10 · 12-20-2002, 10:43 AM

Quote:

idiom: Concentrate this time...
Analogy is sound because:

Blind man cannot see the sun because he is blind.
Skeptic cannot comprehend the Bible because he is blind.

Your analagy is not the least bit sound.

No one has argued whether he can see the sun. But the point of the OP is that, just because he cannot see the sun, does not mean he cannot test and confirm its existence. Numerous posts have demonstrated ways to validate the sun's existence without relying on sight.

A skeptic, on the other hand, might comprehend the bible but reject it as fact due to its manay contradictions, or reject it's message as divine, due to all the awful messages within it.

I think what you mean to say is that you believe skeptics cannot see god because they are blind.

If this is true, do you care to demonstrate other tangible ways of ascertaining god's existence, as was done with the sun?

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12-17-2002, 06:54 AM	#42
Shadowy Man Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: A Shadowy Planet Posts: 7,585	As I mentioned before, Kent Cullers is a blind astronomer. He has been blind since birth. The blind astronomer in the movie Contact was based on him. I am willing to bet a large sum of money that that blind man believes in sunlight though he has never seen it.

12-17-2002, 06:54 AM	#43
abe smith Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: springfield, MA. USA Posts: 2,482	(Wow, the great thing about this thread is that I can click out of it & walk away! Ain' modren technology wunnerful?)

12-18-2002, 03:58 PM	#46
Seraphim Guest Posts: n/a	By Corgan "HUH?! earlier in Malaysian Politics at Political Discussions: "My reply : It is the strong ones who made Malaysia as it is now, not weakenings. Yes, Earth is for those who deserve it - those who cherish its beauty and wonder about meaning of things and not ones who makes up theories and hide behind it." Aren't you suppose to blame ourselves, inferior Malayans when the Portugese took over our shores? " My reply : You're a Malaysian, right? I'm sure you are familiar with the history of Melaka and Perak and how the Resident of British came to be in those two states. You decide who to blame. By galiel "In sum: lighten up, read a little, learn a little, and don't be so sure you have already divined everything the universe has to teach you. And, if you wish to engage in rational discussion, learn the basic tools of the trade. " My reply : Thank you for your advice. I have already bookmarked those site which I can open. By Kharakov "Some societies thrive on interaction with and introduction of foreign elements. Other societies are not strong or adaptable enough to handle foreign elements. " My reply : Yes, true. Several countries managed to mingle in enough with the foreigners to bring some modern concepts into their country such as Japan, Thailand (a.k.a Siam at the time) and Egypt. Even in my country, Malaysia, a state called Johor (near Singapore) managed to stay the longest without a Resident installed into its government due to its clever local ruler till about 1907. But in the end, they also fall ... if it is not for internal factor, it is for external factor.

12-19-2002, 04:47 PM	#47
Butters Regular Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Houston Texas Posts: 444	My reply: why am I still reading bullshit written by someone that STILL can't figure out the UBB code?

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