ex-idaho

Why do the poor in the US vote for politicians that overwhelmingly support favors for the wealthy? Is it because they all hope that someday they will be wealthy? Or is it they vote on other issues and tend to give little thought to taxes?

You would think that the poor would vote for candidates that promise to raise taxes on the rich and increase federal spending on assistance programs like job training, unemployment support and medical programs. Why do the poor undercut themselves? They outnumber the wealthy and the middle class combined and could wield tremendous political power.

Daleth

ex-idaho,

My not-very-educated opinion is that most people don't have much of a grasp on the subjet of economics. (I sure fit that bill.) I think when most people hear "tax cut" they think it means they save a little money and stop thinking about it there. Every penny in my pocket is a penny in my pocket. They don't have the background to understand the results.

Dal

Hubble head

I wonder that too. Back in college I was just finding my political compass and right off the bat recognized that I was surrounded by pro-Reganites and Bushies who had very little for themselves. Having to find ways to pay for all my education myself right out of high school should have knocked me into the lefts' corner back then but it didn't.

I didn't like Clinton so I never considered myself more on left until I was hit smack dab in the face with the brutal ignorance of this new regime.

As long as you have the churches selling out the votes of their predominately poor members to whatever political party gives them the most power and voice, you will have the paradox we have in America today.

Interstingly enough, Trotsky wrote some on the poor's easily shaped political POV in his pamphlet "Fascism-What it is and how to fight it" here:

http://eserver.org/history/fighting-fascism/

Jat

Ironically enough much of the poor don't actually vote in the USA, and neither do most of the rich either. The one's who vote the most are the middle-class.

The poor mainly believe that their votes don't count (Dubya proved this in the election). And the rich know that they don't have to bother with voting since whomever gets in will work to mainly benefit them.

theyeti

I think it's because they're duped into thinking that whatever's best for the wealthy is best for them. People tend overwhemingly to support their own self-interests. The Republicans know this quite well, and so their strategy is to confuse the average person -- or outright lie to them -- about what's really in their own best interests. It's not for nothing that Bush keeps referring to the latest round of tax cuts as a "jobs and growth" package, even though I doubt that even the most hardcore supply-sider actually believes it. But the average slob will buy into it if it's repeated enough times, because they don't have the necessary background to judge the quality of the claim, and they're usually too trusting to think that the President would willfully lie to them -- a trust that the Right takes full advantage of. (And in order to keep abusing this trust, they put on a sickening fa�ade of "honor" and constantly attack the other side's integrity for bullshit that never happened.) The game is simply to make most people think that the tax cuts will be good for them, even though they won't. That's how they win support. It's game the Rovians plays masterfully.

My favorite example of this tactic is with the estate tax. Right-wing propaganda has convinced a majority of the public that Uncle Sam will be taking almost all of their hard-earned cash away from little Johnny and Jane upon their death. Every year, thousands upon thousands of farms and businesses are ruined because of the estate tax. Nothing could be further from the truth. In reality, only the wealthiest 2% pay any estate taxes at all, and the average estate pays only a modest 16% or so. The majority of estate taxes come from the wealthiest 0.1%. There are no documented cases of anyone ever having lost a farm because of estate taxes, and both farms and small businesses are given large exemptions. Estate taxes rank way down the list for reasons why small businesses fail after their founder's death. In fact, given the standard 1 million dollar exemption, there's no way that little Johnny or Jane won't be left wealthy if estate taxes are applied. But through a coordinated campaign of lies, the Right has convinced Americans that what benefits the top 0.1% will in fact benefit you, and because of it a majority of people support repeal. The Right then takes those poll numbers and uses them in a circular fashion to claim that the estate tax must be burdensom to the average joe, because otherwise they wouldn't support repeal. It's depressing.

theyeti

theyeti

Actually, the rich are more likely to vote than the middle class. As a general rule, as income increases, so does likelihood of voting. And as income increases, so does likelihood of voting Republican. The majority of Americans consider themselves Democrats. If voter apathy wasn't an epidemic, the Republicans, who don't represent the interests of most people, would be soundly whipped in every election.

theyeti

John Hancock

Most poor are not inspired to vote because there aren't any politicians courageous enough to bit the interests wealthy enough to fund modern political campaigns. One way that this situation could be lessened would be organized broadcast of the facts and some organization that would make it easy to contact your legislators. Like maybe a free pop and hot dogs and balloons for kids (get the kids worked up to harass the parents to participate).

Poor people seldom have time to explore the news sources all their tired ass butts can handle after working jobs normally requiring two men is to flop in front of the tube.

Where's the money coming for this. Yes I hear the echo of Will Rogers.

Martin

fatherphil

they should vote for the side that is willing to kill the rich and divide up the spoils amongst the poor.

but would not the fairest system tax everyone the same flat tax rate?

Cheiron

No. That would assume that everybody impacts society in exactly the same way. I'll make it quite clear that I am definetely not the person to talk to about economics, but quite frankly a flat tax is not fair in anything but a strictly communist society. Even then a graded tax would have to be implemented due to different professions being paid different ammounts.

Under an ideal system where everybody impacted society in exactly the same way, ie all created the same ammount of jobs, all participated equally in society, and all used the infrastructure of the country equally then yes a flat tax would be the fairest system out there.

However, society is not like that.

And that's without getting into things like a debt to the society that allowed you to earn what you earn. Arguably without the surrounding society very few people would make the money that they do. As such paying higher taxes is your debt to society. Effectively the money you made is society's and society is just lending it to you for a while.

Although maybe I made absolutely no sense there, but hey, like i said, economics is not my specialty.

Jolimont

I'm surrounded by republicans, so I know a little about this. Here I sit in a half million dollar home doing grass roots for Howard Dean (www.deanforamerica.com) while there are people all over my State that live in trailor homes, drive crap and never see a dentist who are fucking proud to vote republican. Life is getting sweeter for me while they won't be able to hang on to their loser jobs or get decent health care, never mind an education, that's only for those who are too stupid to clean floors, right? These are people who are proud to be ignorant! They want it that way! They don't know that the pie is only so big and when I get a bigger peace of it they are getting robbed.

I've seen republican renters be upset about possible property tax hikes (which they don't pay) just on the principle of it. I should say thank you I guess for keeping my taxes low, but it doesn't make me happy to see their kids go to schools where they can't afford enough teachers or enough supplies. I don't need another tax break and all they have to do is vote for candidates who support squeezing me a bit (such as Howard Dean), but do they do that? Nope. So my condescending conclusion is they are stupid. And yes, I wish I could change that.