Freethought & Rationalism Archive

HelenM · 01-22-2003, 09:32 AM

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Originally posted by Radorth
The "prayer" studies give entirely mixed results.

I was arguing that emotions and physical health are inexorably connected as they say.

But I don't think anyone has argued that point. You can be an atheist and believe that. And as I showed, the author is not a theist (you wrote 'they' but there's only one author actually - Clay Tucker-Ladd)

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Furthermore the site notes the majority of illnesses are caused by BAD BEHAVIOR- smoking, illicit sex, etc.

I don't think the author would use the term 'bad behavior' because that implies moral absolutes and I'm not sure he believes in them.

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Read it and weep, skeptics without sin.

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Then tell us which of Paul's "works of the flesh" promotes mental and physical health.

You don't have to look for long on this site to find people who say that religious belief had a very adverse effect on their health.

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No comment on the L.A Times article which came out just the other day?

I don't have access to it because I'm not registered. What did it say?

The other link drew my attention because I'm familiar with that online book and have corresponded with the author in the past.

Helen

Radorth · 01-22-2003, 09:33 AM

No facts or quotes from HJ. Just the typical simplistic and rhetorical questions and gratuitous assertions.

Did you have a specific point?

Rad

hezekiah jones · 01-22-2003, 09:34 AM

No facts or quotes from HJ. Just the typical simplistic and rhetorical questions and gratuitous assertions.

Did you have a specific point?

Just asking you to support yours, whatever it is. Of course if you don't care to address the questions, no one will be particularly suprised, since evasion is your typical modus operandi. This is why most people seem to consider you a troll.

re: "gratuitous assertions." Funny, in an ironic sort of way.

Radorth · 01-22-2003, 06:04 PM

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But I don't think anyone has argued that point.

Good, then we can stop wasting time.

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I don't think the author would use the term 'bad behavior' because that implies moral absolutes and I'm not sure he believes in them.

So we should avoid talking about how bad behavior kills us off because the author doesn't believe in moral absolutes? Or are ou just picking nits with me as you are wont to do?

Well I hope we can at least agree that behavior which kills us off is "bad."

Reminds me of Jesus saying "I come that they might have life, and have it more abundantly." Perhaps we can have a meaningful discussion of how the "works of the flesh" Paul listed are physically and/or emotionally harmful to ourselves and others. I have oft challenged skeptics to tell me how they are NOT harmful and thus worthy to be called "sin."

Rad

ybnormal · 01-22-2003, 07:09 PM

No, Rad, "we" cannot agree. Please stop including me in your personal beliefs for your own emotional stability and comfort.

I am not a xian, I am not involved in your christianity, nor am I involved in your xian "sin", so leave me out of your religion and leave me out of your innermost self-doubt.

Why is it that you require MY validation of your shaky personal beliefs, at the very core of your own self-doubt?

Radorth · 01-22-2003, 07:40 PM

RE: Yb still apparently upset about an old fallout:

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No, Rad, "we" cannot agree.

No problem.

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Please stop including me in your personal beliefs for your own emotional stability and comfort.

Huh? I was merely suggesting something Helen and I might agree on, or anyone else wishing to find some common ground.

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I am not a xian, I am not involved in your christianity,

The thought had crossed my mind while reading your posts

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nor am I involved in your xian "sin" so leave me out of your religion

Not a problem for me, but I see you're in kind of a tizzy for some reason. I guess the word kind of freaks you out, eh?

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and leave me out of your innermost self-doubt. Why is it that you require MY validation of your shaky personal beliefs, at the very core of your own self-doubt

Oh I don't require your validation for anything, I can assure you. Feeling a bit important in your own eyes today? Hey we all do it. Perhaps you could cross me off your list of "People to psychoanalyze today" as well.

Rad

ybnormal · 01-22-2003, 09:44 PM

Oh I don't require your validation for anything, I can assure you.

Oh, but you do indeed require my validation and inclusion in your personal beliefs... if this is not so, retract the statement that your personal god died for my personal benefit.

HelenM · 01-23-2003, 04:54 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Radorth
Good, then we can stop wasting time.

So we should avoid talking about how bad behavior kills us off because the author doesn't believe in moral absolutes? Or are ou just picking nits with me as you are wont to do?

Well I hope we can at least agree that behavior which kills us off is "bad."

Reminds me of Jesus saying "I come that they might have life, and have it more abundantly." Perhaps we can have a meaningful discussion of how the "works of the flesh" Paul listed are physically and/or emotionally harmful to ourselves and others. I have oft challenged skeptics to tell me how they are NOT harmful and thus worthy to be called "sin."

Rad

Rad,

Can you list the "works of the flesh" that you are thinking of?

Helen

Radorth · 01-23-2003, 09:11 AM

You don't know Paul's lists of "the works of the flesh" Helen?

If not, why not?

Rad

HelenM · 01-23-2003, 09:42 AM

Rad, I was trying to move you closer to the meaningful discussion you said you'd like to have, by asking you to get more specific.

Helen

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01-22-2003, 09:33 AM	#132
Radorth Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 1,872	No facts or quotes from HJ. Just the typical simplistic and rhetorical questions and gratuitous assertions. Did you have a specific point? Rad

01-22-2003, 09:34 AM	#133
hezekiah jones Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: WI Posts: 4,357	No facts or quotes from HJ. Just the typical simplistic and rhetorical questions and gratuitous assertions. Did you have a specific point? Just asking you to support yours, whatever it is. Of course if you don't care to address the questions, no one will be particularly suprised, since evasion is your typical modus operandi. This is why most people seem to consider you a troll. re: "gratuitous assertions." Funny, in an ironic sort of way.

01-22-2003, 07:09 PM	#135
ybnormal Regular Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 430	No, Rad, "we" cannot agree. Please stop including me in your personal beliefs for your own emotional stability and comfort. I am not a xian, I am not involved in your christianity, nor am I involved in your xian "sin", so leave me out of your religion and leave me out of your innermost self-doubt. Why is it that you require MY validation of your shaky personal beliefs, at the very core of your own self-doubt?

01-22-2003, 09:44 PM	#137
ybnormal Regular Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 430	*Oh I don't require your validation for anything, I can assure you.* Oh, but you do indeed require my validation and inclusion in your personal beliefs... if this is not so, retract the statement that your personal god died for my personal benefit.

01-23-2003, 09:11 AM	#139
Radorth Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 1,872	You don't know Paul's lists of "the works of the flesh" Helen? If not, why not? Rad

01-23-2003, 09:42 AM	#140
HelenM Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Ill Posts: 6,577	Rad, I was trying to move you closer to the meaningful discussion you said you'd like to have, by asking you to get more specific. Helen

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