Pyrrho

I'm not sweep, but I'll respond anyway. The reason why most people believe that humans are "above" other animals is because of religious nonsense about being made in God's image. This holds for most atheists as well, because religion has had a rather large impact on human society. (Just because someone gives up on the belief in a god, that doesn't mean that they give up on all of the other religious nonsense.)

Sweep is right; humans are animals, and it is ridiculous to suppose that humans are somehow "above" animals.

sweep

the herd stick together. I remember one particular species, possible an arctic species of ox form a phalanx with the young in the middle. nature works that way. when we fail to discriminate among ourselves as potential targets we have a case called 'the enemy within'. That puts the whole community at risk and trust becomes a value, even to the extent that god says so. God is the tool of fear, that keeps us as a herd. We value the importance of trust as a group.

as for the predator, the wolf, or the tiger picks from the outside of the herd; they pick the one that can run the least. survival of the fittest. as JM pointed out: it's them or us...

there are many differences, but the dichotomy of: 'them and us' is founded on a similar principle to 'beer and those other drugs'. they are all drugs but the salient differences are due to a difference of opinion and thereby; a difference in value. nature is not our enemy, but differences can be. when I look more at our similarities, the world becomes a thing of beauty, and not one to be blown up by shotguns.

JusticeMachine

If humans are of equal value to all life, or let's say all life has equal value, and we take into consideration that for my life to continue I have to take the life of others, then I am putting my life, above that of what I kill, thus if I am ending the life of something esle to continue my existance, I must achknowlege that my life is worth more (to me) that the life I sacrifice to live.

So, we (as the human race) consider our life more important than the other life forms on this planet.

That is not to say we don't value the other life forms, just not on the same or equal level. There is no equality.

tudal

So we value other humans more than other forms of life. From this it doesn't follow that humans are inherently of more importance than everything else. What makes me more inherently valuable than, say, my new Samsung cellular phone?

JusticeMachine

I am taking this arguement from a humans point of view. The survival of the species (specifically your own) if what should be the most important.

Say, if humans were an endangered species, and I feel into cracodile infested water, they would eat me, regardless if I were the last of my species or not. Because they value their existance more than mine.

Other animals are not bothered by taking human life, if the need arises, why are we bothered by taking other animal life?

tudal

BECAUSE PUPPIES ARE CUTE!

JusticeMachine

HA, just as I suspected!!!!!!!!

But seriously, are humans the only animal that have a moral problem with killing other animals?

Rusting Car Bumper

There are several reasons. The best is this:

1The problem of evil applies to a monotheistic God because of the claimed simultaneous properties of omnipotence, omniscience, and omni-benelovence. The presences of "evil" is not compatible with these. If God is slightly less than "omni" in any one of these areas then it ceases to be a problem. Also, if there is more than one God then it ceases to be a problem. Thus, it can't be applied to the case you are claiming. There are multiple souls supposedly harming animals and you aren't omni anything... let alone omni-benevelont.

In fact your refraining from "harming animals" may actually harm other animals. In fact, farming is like this. If I am a vegetarian then I add to farm use and farm use by its very nature kicks native animal species off of lands. Thus, it contributes to another form of animal suffering.

Unless you are the only all powerful god then the problem of evil argument can't really apply to you.

DC

sweep

yes. remember that this issue doesn't only concern the killing of other species, it also concerns a way of living for all animals, including humans. We (humans) have the most power, and that makes us more responsible.

We should not, for instance, feed livestock parts of their own species. This has resulted in mad cow disease, and the human variant. some meat manufacturers don't care about quality; they aren't too concerned about animals rights, and they aren't too concerned about what you're eating or who gets worked into an early grave from working in an abatoire. Lack of care equals suffering for the consumer as well as the animals that get processed. I don't have any statistics to show that e-coli claims human lives.

doing harm to other animals for fun, or for any other reason raises questions on the worth of our own actions and the worth of our own lives:

Do we allow the torture of guinea pigs so that human females can keep their hair a certain shape? Look at the cost of labour and resources in favour of this 'odd' compulsion-is it really worth the effort? Why keep a puppy, when the owner decides the puppy should be kept in a damp basement, never let out, allowed to shit everywhere and rarely fed? What purpose does that animal serve? Why does the owner keep that puppy? wouldn't it be easier to not have the puppy, rather than let it starve to death?

JusticeMachine

I agree with much of what you said in your last post. My problem isn't with resposibly using (other) animals as a resource to better our suvival. I too don't feel that makeup is essetial for human survival and think it is a poor use of a resource to use animals for this, but I feel medical research for a cure for aid or cancer is a viable use of this resource. I have no problem eating an animal either, but I do believe that we should have regulations on the conditions the animals are kept under and how they are killed to ensure a quality, healthy produce is delivered to the consumer.

It is the whack jobs at PETA I can't stand, who put animal on an equal moral stature at humans. Animals IMO are A-Moral.