Godless Dave

I like some of the Target Market ads because they focus more on how the tobacco companies targeted teens. Instead of a "don't smoke" message it's more of a "don't be played by the man" message. I think many teenagers smoke to be rebellious (I know I did). Knowing that old white guys in three-piece suits are encouraging and profiting from your "rebellion" puts it in a little different perspective. I don't know any teens though, so I don't know how they are received.

Also unlike the anti-pot ads the anti-nicotine ads seem to contain actual facts instead of scare tactics and lies.

I remember seeing the body-bag ad a bunch of times. They must have pulled it recently.

Scotty

I always think of it like this:

Tobacco farming takes up a bunch of land that could be used for farming to feed the world...(not that we can't already, and don't, but hey, it is how I think sometimes)

Lets say tobacco was no longer used, think of all of the lost jobs in the health care market (critical care I suppose), but then all of the people will get older and use more medicare and Social Security, and need more nursing homes.

The world will be overpopulated with old people, we can't have that.

Hmm, no more trucks to deliver the product, no more Quicky Marts selling them, no more anti-smoking commercials, no more corporate big-wigs with those nice houses.

Can't somebody work on a non carcinogenic replacement that is just as addictive and pleasant to use? Oh, but wait, you can't make something addictive anymore to sell to the public right? What a grandfather clause!

Okay, so maybe something to make you feel good, but be non addictive yet allow you an oral fixation. I mean, can think of one thing...

Of course none of this would be immediately profitable to anybody so that won't happen.

(actually, I never understood smoking from an inhalation standpoint...they send people to the hospital for smoke inhalation. It is amazing what the body gets used to).

-Scott

NialScorva

I think this is the problem, though. The anti-smoking ads reek of being designed by young 20somethings who are on the fast track to becoming "the man", and even in people who aren't overtly anti-authoritarian, they can provoke that response.

Viti

I knew I shouldn't have even ventured into this topic. It's simply one of those things that involves strong feelings. As a smoker I am able to be villified and anything I post that isn't 100% anti-smoking on any of this leads to cries of "what about the children" and the discussion ceases.

My apologies to those who have lost loved ones, I didn't mean to trivialize your experiences.

NialScorva

I grew up in southern Virginia. It's a solid sheet of red clay that isn't terribly conducive to growing a broad range of crops. As far as I can remember, the entire list of things that grow when planted there is tobacco, broccoli, marijuana (seems to grow everywhere), and pine trees. During the early 90s a lot of tobacco farmers tried to switch over to broccoli, at least in part. They couldn't make any money at it, it seems.

Marruk

When I was a teenage girl the only non-smoking ad that ever had any effect on me was the one with Wendy. If any of you remember the comercial you'll know what I am talking about. In being a vain teenage girl like most teenage girls, after seeing that comercial I decided I would never ever smoke durring my life because there was no way that I would ever make myself look and talk like Wendy.

I think the best non-smoking ads for teenagers are actually the ones geared to adults. I wouldn't be surprised if the non-smoking ad that showed men being impotent had an effect on many teenage boys.

brighid

Lady Shea,

As you don't have any children, the comments I made didn't apply to your situation, but only my own to illustrate the difference between your familial experience and my own. You truly are the exception and I have no beef with your personal, adult choice to do as you rightfully please with your own body.

However, I do take exception with parents who expose their children to things that are proven to be detrimental to their health, smoking being one among many things that subjects many children to a life long legacy not of their own chosing. I have the same problem with obese parents(whose children are also obese) especially because in both cases these things are completely avoidable.

I did not mean to offend you, or imply anything in your actions but only to contrast it with my own experience. I am sorry if you felt differently about my post.

Edited to add: Also, my experience is as valid as your own and I am a product of a smoking family. My illnesses can never be cured, and the damage done never erased. Unfortunately my daily life and health are constantly challenged by the results of my parents actions. I personally harbor some resentment because I know my life and health could me much different. But that is really neither here, nor there ... just my experience growing up in a smoking household.

B

Viti

Brighid...I am not offended at all, and I am so sorry your family has had to deal with so many health issues. Even my post to bow out of the discussion didn't come out right I suppose!

My problem with all of this is that the studies out there do not prove conclusively that second hand smoke is a direct cause of some of these health issues in children. There I have said it...I opened the can of worms.

Is it possible that some families have a genetic disposition towards these illnesses? I certainly know families with kids with asthma, allergies, chronic infections, etc that have no smokers anywhere to be seen. My friend Steve is one of them, the one who ended up needing a kidney.

Brighid, you are someone I admire and respect and like very very much...and I would like to have this discussion with you, I just don't want it to lead to any offense or bad feelings and I am afraid it will simply because of the topic...thats my concern here.

NialScorva

Correct me if I'm wrong, I seem to recall hearing that the heath effects of second hand smoke are largely not borne out by the research.

edit: After a quick dive with google, the only things I'm coming up with are from the Washington Times (which can be thrown away on without further viewing), and from tobacco lobbies. I seem to recall hearing that the testimony in front of congress was a metastudy, and when directly asked the person testifying said "yes, the research may not indicate what we claim it does, but we have the word out and that's all that matters." or something to that effect. Anyone have anything on this?

brighid

LadyShea,

I am glad you weren't offended

I know LOTS of kids whose families are non-smokers that have the problems you speak of. I do not, at this moment, have all the knowledge necessary to have a well educated and researched debate on this.

Asthma can be, as far as I remember (off the top of my head) genetic. I am not sure that it always IS genetic. At least in my family I was the first to ever be diagnosed with it. I know of no other cousins that have it, either on my father's side or my mother's side.

I would really have to do a lot more research at this moment to have this discussion with you, and I too would like to have it. I think we can have it, and keep it civil by remembering that this isn't meant to personally attack anyone else, but rather debate and educate each other on a topic.

Let me see what I can dig up.

If my asthma has been genetically inherited (which is possible) it certainly wasn't helped by my parents heavy smoking. It was in fact hindered and they were told for years that I should not be exposed to it because it will worsen my condition.

I do have asthmatic reactions to thinks I am allergic too as well, and my allergies have changed over the years. My asthma is pretty much triggered by most everything in the air, although different environments and climates seem to produce less symptoms (such as sand, oceans and palm trees being very positive for my health ) However, smoke really does a doozie on me. I heavily medicate myself before, during and after spending but a few hours with my family (even the light smokers). This was my life as a child, and I was pretty sickly.

Brighid