Corona688

Sad to say, this principle simply doesn't work in a pure scientific sense, because it is nearly impossible to DISprove anything, no matter how ludicrous.

Prove I don't have an invisible monkey in my backyard. If I say it exists, there is literally *nothing* you can do to prove it does not. I can try and show the existence of the monkey through any available evidence; footprints, dung, infrared and ultraviolet photographs, etc. In the absence of evidence, however, I'd very much hope you would reject my claim as the ludicrous fantasy it is!

The same goes with the paranormal. You say it exists; good for you. Prove it!

Summon up some demony badness in front of a panel of physics professors using your handy ouiga board. Several times. And be sure to take photographs. And have someone else repeat this experiment independently. THAT ought to prove the existence of the supernatural once and for all. If you can think of a better experiment than my silly example, go ahead and try it instead; but you have to do SOMETHING.

Can't do it? Sorry, but that's your problem, not mine.

Science is damn hard work.

[ December 13, 2002: Message edited by: Corona688 ]</p>

galiel

Waste of time. New definition of "lockbox" = see this thread.

Synaesthesia

The social construction of severe hysteria is important, but it's never as something as simple as instruction.

A notable case is MDP. Like demon posession, it only happens to people who live in places where it's believed in. (In Britain, for example, if somebody claims to have it, the doctor insists that everyone is multifaceted and must take responsibility for all of themselves. Cases there are nearly unheard of. In America during the peak of the MPD delusion, thousands of cases popped up, all within the doors of a few psychiatrists who blieved in it. Odd, eh?)

However, do not underestimate the power of such experiences. Simply because the delusion is false does not mean that it's not an intense experience. I don't know how you came to the conclusion that intense experience justifies crackpot theories about them, but I assure you, mental illness can be absolutely shatteringly powerful.

The holmsian logic sounds reasonable, but let us not forget that Doyle was well known to be gullible. There is never one remaining possibility, there is never the total elimination of a possibility. If you think there is (This could ONLY be a miracle, this could ONLY be a conspiracy) you've made a mistake somewhere.

Godless Dave

I can. From your description I think it's likely you have a brain condition which causes seizures and hallucinations, a form of epilepsy or something like it.

Walross

Originally posted by Corona688:

Make sure there are a few conjurers of James Randi's calibre around as well - according to many magicians, Physicists tend to be notoriously easy to fool when it comes to sleight of hand.

Walross

[ December 13, 2002: Message edited by: Walross ]</p>

Mad Kally

I'm glad you are not a part of the medical field. Status Epilepticus is incompatible with life. Even if a person only has one seizure in their lifetime, your medical records should state "Hx of seizures". No ghosts, goblins, demons, or trolls under the bridge required.

If people are barking and growling like a dog, I would suggest a mental health professional.

BTW, if you are going to continue posting so much, try to learn a little of this <a href="http://iidb.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=ubb_code_page" target="_blank"> UBB code. </a>

[ December 13, 2002: Message edited by: Mad Kally ]</p>

Seraphim

"Seraphim, that article obviously flew so far over your head I didn't bother responding. I probably should have so I apologise. To clarify, you missed the point ... again. "

My reply : Nonsense, I made a perfectly acceptable remarks on your so-called "Universally accepted" logic. Take it or leave it.

"Honestly, I don't mind arrogance so much when it comes with some intellectual ability, but I assure you, yours is quite misplaced.

Maybe it's that as your second language you don't grasp the articles which are written for English speakers, but so far I can't recall you actually understanding a single link I've posted. Oddly we have quite a few people for whom English is a second language but by and large they understand better than your good self. You should spend more time reading and less typing. "

My reply : Maybe in your society arrogance mind can produce intellectual replies, in mine ... or at least, in my opinion, it doesn't. I keep my mind open of ALL possibilities since it is illogical to assume that we know everything.

I don't spend a lot of time either reading or typing, I spend most of it on observing and understanding what I see, then revalue it from what I know, make new assumptions and match it to those principles I know, if cannot find one, I will look for a new one to see whether what I see or observe fits the bill or not. This is how my logic works ... how's yours?

By Corona688

"Sad to say, this principle simply doesn't work in a pure scientific sense, because it is nearly impossible to DISprove anything, no matter how ludicrous."

My reply : Yes, true. Do you know why? It is not because such phenomena which we are trying to understand doesn't exist, it is because we have lack of data or tools to make the proper assumptions.

"Prove I don't have an invisible monkey in my backyard. If I say it exists, there is literally *nothing* you can do to prove it does not. I can try and show the existence of the monkey through any available evidence; footprints, dung, infrared and ultraviolet photographs, etc. In the absence of evidence, however, I'd very much hope you would reject my claim as the ludicrous fantasy it is!

The same goes with the paranormal. You say it exists; good for you. Prove it!

Summon up some demony badness in front of a panel of physics professors using your handy ouiga board. Several times. And be sure to take photographs. And have someone else repeat this experiment independently. THAT ought to prove the existence of the supernatural once and for all. If you can think of a better experiment than my silly example, go ahead and try it instead; but you have to do SOMETHING.

Can't do it? Sorry, but that's your problem, not mine.

Science is damn hard work."

My reply : Science is never hard work, what makes it hard is your understanding of things. No one is stupid, just ignorant.

"The holmsian logic sounds reasonable, but let us not forget that Doyle was well known to be gullible. There is never one remaining possibility, there is never the total elimination of a possibility. If you think there is (This could ONLY be a miracle, this could ONLY be a conspiracy) you've made a mistake somewhere. "

My reply : One thing which made Holmsian logic (odd name, but I will go with it) unique is that it take crime and criminal as case studies rather than the whole society and their problem.

If a murder occurs, the starting logical assumptions is - 1. it was commited by someone the victim knows such as a family member or 2. friend OR someone outside this circle or 3. It is an accident. This options can be determined by checking the crime scene such as the methods in which the victim died and the surroundings.

Surrounding factors such as forced entry usually means an outsider was involved but by checking for tell-tale signs of it been staged, you could know whether the victim was killed by someone he knows or not, thus eliminating either 1 or 2 options. Checking on the background of the victim and his habit could bring new possibilities and suspects for this crime.

However, there is a new possibility that this is indeed cause by an outsider but at the same time staged by someone the victim was closed at, so checking on his (the victim's) family relationship and background will bring newever possiblities.

In goes on and on till more possibilities is eliminated and at each elimination, a puzzle will be solved by logic such as why he died in such way, what was the cause, motive etc.

PS : Sorry for the long statements, but such things as this do get me interested.


By Godless Dave

"I can. From your description I think it's likely you have a brain condition which causes seizures and hallucinations, a form of epilepsy or something like it. "

My reply : Logical assumption. Mind telling me it only happened to me and another girl I knew ONCE only? If it is condition of the brain, surely multiple seizures should follow in months or years time, I'm 31 years old, I have yet to experienced another one, nor that girl I was telling you about.

Mad Kally

People fall on the ground and flop around all the time after hearing those Charismatic prosperity preachers. It does not mean they are epileptics. It means that they really believe they are possessed. They most likely behaved that way because it was expected of them. (think brainwashing)

Seraphim

"People fall on the ground and flop around all the time after hearing those Charismatic prosperity preachers. It does not mean they are epileptics. It means that they really believe they are possessed. They most likely behaved that way because it was expected of them. (think brainwashing) "

My reply : Yeah, I heard such things also. But I wasn't hearing any Christian preacher at the time nor I was told by anyone to fall down and behave like possessed, nor did I lose about 12 hours of a day simply because it was expected of me.

Charismatic prosperity preachers? Does such people (if existed) in your country supposed to make someone behave like a loony?

[ December 13, 2002: Message edited by: Seraphim ]</p>

galiel

Where is Vanna White when you need her?