Vanderzyden

I, for one, I appreciate your candor, Aerik. You are telling us that the idea of worship is repugnant.

This is perhaps the most common view among atheists: If God exists and he requires acknowledgement that he is Lord of All--that is, he demands my worship--then it seems that I would rather spend eternity apart from him.

Do the other atheists who read this agree?

Vanderzyden

Jamie_L

Actually, I would worship God if I thought he were real. If I thought he was benevolent, I'd pay him homage to him. If I thought he was wicked and evil, I'd probably do what he said so that he didn't tortue me and my loved ones for eternity. As I said before, I don't reject the idea of a god as being repugnant. I just don't believe it.

Jamie

K

Vanderzyden:

No, that is not my veiw. I can not even comprehend a being as powerful as God is purported to be that would even be bothered with requiring His creations to worship Him. My wife and I created our children and we wouldn't require them to worship us. How much more non-sensical is it for a deity with all of the powers of God to require it from us?

Besides, from what I posted earlier, it should be apparent that I beleive that if the Christian God created us, He did so knowing perfectly well that many of us wouldn't worship Him. Since, He was happy with that design, He wouldn't possibly hold it against us.

wdog

another logical progression

1. God made adam and eve knowing their faults, and knowing that eve would bite the apple. He pretends anyway that they will obey. (see 1, B, and C)

2. when eve takes the apple, gods acts surprised, even though he knew it was going to happen (see 1)

3. god boots them from eden, again an act that he knew was going to happen before he created them (see 1, and B)


what kind of sick being would do such a thing?

Copernic

Er...yep.
On a personal note - Any God that demands my adoration and worship under threat of eternal hellfire is not worth my time. To me, that's synonymous with me coming to you Vander, and saying "Be my friend or die!" Yeaaa, I'd rather not.

On a temporal note - Eternity is a mighty long time (per Prince). My current psyche would consider staring forever at God quite unbearable. To me, that is Hell.
For me to be transmutified into a psyche that can handle eternity, then that wouldn't really be me, would it. I have a finite mind now. For God to tweak it so I can appreciate and exist in eternity would be a considerable change to my character. Either way, I don't get to enjoy eternal adoration of your God.

After reading these 14 pages I don't believe Xeron ever got her answer. Why is Xeron going to Hell?

Thanks
J

MrKrinkles

A perfectly valid question for the believer who thinks his religion/cult actually makes some kind of sense. Of course the real answer is that Christianity is just a cynical con game and the threat of hellfire is nothing more than a powerful psychological inducement to join the cult and fork over cash to its leaders.

It is kind of funny because the idea of hell is undergoing a bit of a makeover nowadays. If Christian ministers and preachers do talk about hell now, they no longer speak about God's responsibility for hell, or God casting people into hell. Instead they have concocted the notion that it is actually the unbeliever's "choice" to go to hell, that unbelievers "want" to go to hell, and that hell is simply a "separation" from God, nothing more. Obviously Christian apologists have come to understand that in today's society the idea of torturing people eternally simply because of their opinions is no longer considered to be, well, politically correct. So they have manipulated Christian doctrines accordingly. Or they simply do not talk about the issue of hell.

<a href="http://members.aol.com/bbu83/hell.htm" target="_blank">Article: Hell losing its fire in American sermons--'Too negative' for today's worshipers</a>

Brooks

[ October 07, 2002: Message edited by: MrKrinkles ]</p>

RJS

Maybe we all go to heaven, but some just view it like hell. Probably not an original thought - but it came to mind last night as I was reading Great Divorce - and CS Lewis references a book "Marriage of Heaven and Hell."

[ October 07, 2002: Message edited by: RJS ]

[ October 07, 2002: Message edited by: RJS ]</p>

Copernic

This reminds me of an Asimov short story entitled "The Last Answer" where even God considered his own eternal existance Hell. Thought provoking.
Regards
J

wdog

well, as I said in another thread I would not condemn xeren to eterenal seperation. just as I would not do that to any child of mine. so what does it say when I have more mercy and compasssion for those 'imperfect humans' than a supposedly perfect god with infinite mercy?

if mere me has more mercy, why would I want to hang around some sadistic perfectionist who needs to be worshiped?

sandlewood

Takes things in order. What comes first is that you have to be convinced that a god exists before you can worry about whether you should worship him or not. Then you have to figure out what the god is before you decide whether he deserves worship. (Would you worship an evil god just because he happened to be the creator the universe?)

After that, I agree with K. Why would an omnipotent god need worship? What exactly does a god get out of worship? Does it charge him with energy? How does he get enjoyment from listening to humans mechanically repeating the same ritualistic prayers in a monotone over and over again? And even if he gets enjoyment out of it, should we all sacrifice the rest of our existence so that this being can get enjoyment?