Gurdur

Well, I suppose we should be grateful to Jat for explaining himself and his background; one could only wish that revisionists had spelling training as well as "apologenic" training.

Amen-Moses

Originally posted by Jat
"The whole field of Ancient Near Eastern archaeology (minus the crackpots and fundamentalists in Bob Jones University and the like), have no time for the Exodus/Canaanite invasion myth."

.....

"Quote whatever names you want. It is still not a generally accepted theory."

What is it about "whole" that is eluding you? In my book "the whole field" is reasonably translated as "generally accepted".

Amen-Moses

Jat

If it were truly the "whole" field than there wouldn't be any disagreement as in those label as crackpots and fundamentalists.

Anyways this entire conversation is irrlevant to the thread. As I had said, it is all a matter of motive. This discussion is closed before any more apologists show up to "defend the faith".

Celsus

Jat,

Alas, the evidence is there for all to see. You have not made an actual point or shown any evidence, only slander on all of pages 3-4 of this thread. As you well know, all sciences have their crackpots, whether it's people hunting for perpetual motion devices against the good advice of physicists, homeopathic cures against the advice of doctors, creationists against all of biology, paleontology, geology, etc., or Biblical fundamentalists against any science that doesn't assume God first. You still don't get it. Very well, continue to cling to your dogma.

Sorry to disappoint, Gurdur and A-M. You know what they say about horses and water.

Joel

Tristan Scott

What? Closed before you can cite one resource to back your claims?

Tristan Scott

Who are you quoting here? Who has said 'the only significant genocide in history' ? I have never heard anyone say such a thing.

Gurdur

Naaaaaaw, I'm only disappointed that you haven't been Officially Informed You Are On An Ignore List yet.

I could lose money on this !

Gurdur

Precisely. The Holocaust is a rather unique event (and no, it needn't have ever happened); however, no-one here has claimed it is the only significant genocide in history.

In fact, it's rather tasteless, as well as deeply suspect, that some (not Optional) keep on attacking the Holocaust in the most strawman of fashions.
The fact that the 20th century alone also saw genocides of Armenians, Gypsies (Rom and Sind), and Tutsi, does not diminish the meaning of the Holocaust. One evil never justifies the banalization of another evil.

Jat

What? You calling most of the Jews in the world liars? How anti-semitic of you.

Rusting Car Bumper

I've given lectures on refuting holocaust deniers before to skeptics groups and high schools. In fact, I gave a talk on holocaust deniers for the 2002 Atheist Alliance convention. I wanted to make a few points.

Your claim is not accurate. The usual "6 million figure" is a rough average of the low and high numbers of all Jews killed in the Holocaust. Those numbers range from about 5.2 to 6.5 million. It does not include only death camps. It's fairly well agreed upon by historians that 6 million were not killed in death camps alone. The 6 million number includes mobile killing squads called Einsatzgruppen, death camps and ghettos.

In fact, its this sort of innacuracy that holocaust deniers use to claim that people are be fooled by "pro holocaust propoganda." The user peoples mistaken impression, however slight they may be, to try to break the armor of facts and reason.

It's very important to understand that many prominent holocaust scholars are not idiots, are often are accurate in their facts, and knowledgable of the holocaust. THey take advantage of this and recognize and discuss only a limited breadth of these facts to try to convince the people of the general public who know very little other than "Nazis killed 6 million Jews."

See an article about one of my presentations here:
Holocaust Revisionism and Denial

DC