Bree

I don't fully understand what you mean by this.

Can you elaborate?

St. Robert

Sexual attraction is not a valid basis for a person's identity, because it is a behavior.

Being a specific age, gender, or race is a valid basis for a person's identity, because these traits don't involve a particular behavior.

Gay and lesbian people are labeled as homosexual, because of their sexual attraction or sexual behavior. It is similar for the alcoholic. "I am an alcoholic, because I drink heavily." or "I am a Christian, because I go to church on Sunday."

More later.

Bree

Okay, wow - thanks for the clarification. My thoughts are right in line with yours, but I wanted to make sure before I opened my big fat mouth.

I for one do not label myself first and foremost a 'lesbian' - if someone were to ask me to define who exactly Bree is and what exactly makes up a Bree, I'd be more likely to tell you about my likes and dislikes rather than my sexual preferences.

oneofshibumi

Japan practiced homosexuality openly until contact with the West in the late 1500s and early 1600s. The Jesuit priest Francis Xavier was surprised that it was practiced so openly in Japanese society.
<a href="http://www.geocities.co.jp/Berkeley/3508/japanesehistory.html" target="_blank">http://www.geocities.co.jp/Berkeley/3508/japanesehistory.html</a>

Christianity is the fourth largest religion in Japan. This site places the number at 1% of the population.
<a href="http://gbgm-umc.org/country_profiles/country_mission_profile.cfm?Id=57" target="_blank">http://gbgm-umc.org/country_profiles/country_mission_profile.cfm?Id=57</a>

Other Asians countries that have smaller percentages of Christians include:
Afghanistan &gt; 0.1%
Bangladesh &gt; 0.3%
Bhutan &gt; 0.1%
China &gt; 0.2%
India &gt; 0.1%
Iran &gt; 0.1%
Iraq &gt; 0.1%
Kazakhstan &gt; 0.1%
Kyrgyzstan &gt; 0.1%
Laos &gt; 0.1%
Mongolia &gt; 0.1%
Myanmar (Burma) &gt; 1%
Nepal &gt; 0.1%
Tajikistan &gt; 0.1%
Uzbekistan &gt;0.1%

Sources:
<a href="http://gbgm-umc.org/country_profiles" target="_blank">http://gbgm-umc.org/country_profiles</a>
<a href="http://www.britannica.com" target="_blank">http://www.britannica.com</a>

Agnos1

I'll simply state again that IF homosexuality was simply a behavior or viewpoint, then Christianity and God, by being displeased with the viewpoint is automatically addressing the individual. Bree said it herself, that what makes up "Bree" are likes, dislikes, etc. the sum total which INCLUDES sexual preference. A person IS his/her likes/dislikes.

Science is NOT behind the times, but AMOS certainly is if he thinks homosexuality is on the increase (due to negligent parents or whatever). Fact is, homosexuality has always been a part of human nature and is only talked about more now which must give AMOS the impression of an "increase."

oneofshibumi

If homosexuality is a view point, then heterosexuality is a view point. As a heterosexual I know that my desire of the opposite sex has been with me for as long as I can remember. In pre-kindergarten I had a crush on my female teacher. I did NOT choose the behavior. However, a case can also be made for males, humans and animals, when in captivity can change desire to the same sex. Examples, jail or zoos. Of course, in jail sometimes the change is not voluntary. Overwhelming majority of prisoners do not change their behavior voluntarily in jail.

GeoTheo

I had a crush on my female kindergarten teacher as well. That doesn't mean I wanted to engage in intercourse with her. That probably had somthing to do with the fact that I didn't know what intercourse was.
As far as your other point:
You are arguing that Japan does not recognize Gay marriage because it is one percent Christian?
Very tenuous line of arguement at best.

Bree

I don't speak for anyone else, but I'm arguing that your Japan/Christianity comparison was a straw man and that you should get back to the real debate.

For example, how about this: the Bible says that homos are an abomination and should be killed. Christians follow the Bible. Therefore the Bible implants a skewed outlook on gays and lesbians simply because the Bible says so. Whether they actually act on these impulses (kill/maim/picket a funeral) is another topic.

FreeToThink

Ahh, but the clever Christian responds that killing gays was what was required under the "law", not what is required under the current state "of grace". It will be argued that Xians are to "love" gays, by telling them about Jesus, and informing them that they can "change". This is what I used to hear at my fundagelical megachurch on the subject of how to treat gays.

[aside]
Of course, there is currently an antidiscrimination ordinance being contemplated in Orlando that would prohibit such things as firing someone because they are gay, or refusing to rent to someone b\c their gay, etc., and said megachurch has a petition on the front page of their freakin' website in opposition to the ordinance. OHHHHH yeah, little fundies - your true colors are showing. Some kinda love... "I luv yew bruther, and ta show it, I'm gonna fire yew and not rent yew a home, doncha see the luv of Jaysus! Doncha wanna beecome a Chrishun now?"

The bile is rising up in my throat even now.

[/aside]

oneofshibumi

Geotheo, that is not my argument. Actually, I am arguing that homosexuality became a no-no in Japan after contact with the West, Holland for example. The laws now on the books were imposed by the United States after World War II. Historically speaking, the United States usually imposes its biases also. This is done by selecting people who will support US aims and beliefs. An example, in 1898 the US required the segregation of schools in Puerto Rico and Cuba. In the case of Puerto Rico, it also required that all official business be conducted in English. So if you were taking to court, the trail would be English, not Spanish the language of the Island. Later on only English speaking teachers could work in the school system.

As for the list of countries that have a lower Christian population, the purpose was to show that Japan was not one of the least Christian countries in Asia.