Freethought & Rationalism Archive

emotional · 06-30-2003, 03:49 PM

I see no contradiction here.

NZAmoeba · 06-30-2003, 03:51 PM

emotional... care to explain why god never thought to mention about all this wonderous creation? instead he seemed to have downplayed it a fair bit.... 'skydome' indeed!

emotional · 06-30-2003, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by NZAmoeba
emotional... care to explain why god never thought to mention about all this wonderous creation? instead he seemed to have downplayed it a fair bit.... 'skydome' indeed!

First off, I'm not a Christian, or any other Bible-believer for that matter. I believe in a 15 billion year old universe and a 4.6 billion year old solar system, including a Big Bang and theistic evolution. This wondrous creation has been revealed by scientific investigation, not by an ancient book (indeed this is one of the few points where I find science to my liking).

The Bible was written by ignorant, pre-scientific men. Their view of the cosmos is basically the child's view: the stars are tiny points of light stuck on the skydome, and the sun and moon are great lights ruling the day and night respectively. I don't believe in the Biblical cosmos, I don't believe in the same Biblical god, but both they and I derive awe and wonder from the cosmos. They were right in saying the cosmos is awe-inspiring, they just hadn't an idea how awe-inspiring.

Autonemesis · 06-30-2003, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by emotional
Such is the necessity when one lives in our scientific age, where science has eroded all comforting beliefs.

And that is a source of comfort.

Shadowy Man · 06-30-2003, 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by emotional
I see no contradiction here.

I didn't say there was...

NZAmoeba · 06-30-2003, 08:57 PM

Quote:

First off, I'm not a Christian, or any other Bible-believer for that matter.

Fine, I can accept that point of veiw.

So what about the hardcore xtians that have posted on this thread? Magus? care to explain why the vast cosmos designed for your enjoyment has been incorrectly described by god himself? Surely he would know that there's no such thing as a skydome?

wordsmyth · 06-30-2003, 09:46 PM

Let me see if I can formulate what the standard fundamentalist response usually is.

Atheist: How can you believe the bible is the word of an all knowing God when it is filled with contradictions and absurdities?

Theist: There are no contradictions or absurdities in the bible.

Atheist: What about this passage here where it describes something that is clearly absurd and outright false?

Theist: Its simple really. What the bible says and what it really means aren't the same thing. You aren't reading the bible the way it was intended. Here, take this bible and smack yourself in the head with it a few hundred times and the bibles true(tm) meaning will start to become clear.

Atheist:

Theist:

Atheist:

... ok, so maybe thats not exactly the standard fundamentalist response, but its the general impression I always get.

ChrisW · 06-30-2003, 10:26 PM

more like:

Atheist: here's my big list of biblical contradictions [insert website here]

Theist: here's my big list a refutations [insert website here]

Atheist: well your refutations aren't good enough

Theist: well your contradictions aren't good enough

Enter bandwagon of theists or atheists (depending on the forum)

Atheist or Theist feels vindicated because the majority agrees with them, they therefore won the debate.

quite fun to watch really.

Randy X · 07-01-2003, 12:17 AM

Hi everyone, my name is Christ and i'm a very proud Athiest.Many years ago I was once a Christian, now i'm a Christian no more.My "God" is really the TLOP=The laws of physics.

Quote:

Can I puke now? God loves us so much that if we do not choose to believe in his 'son' as our savior then he is going to torture us eternally. DAD OF THE FUCKIN YEAR I tell ya! So all the people that used their intellect, logic, reasoning Etc to choose to not believe in God are doomed. People who cannot conclude that God is real because some erroneous and self contradictory book makes the assertion while scientific observation of the universe yields ZERO evidence for the existence of such a deity are going to be burning forever. FOREVER! He made this grand universe just for us, this endless expanse of space to make him all the more elusive, just for us. In fact he created all he laws of nature to demonstrate the complete lack of need for divine intervention, just cause he loves us. God made me smart enough to question his existence, deny it, and make me suffer for eternity for it. I got one middle finger on each hand up for God..

We speak on the same plain, my friend.God is a fiction, and everyone knows that you cannot falsify a fiction.Genesis 1, the earth was created flat, and believers thought the Sun was an ordament(how else would they get such illogical thoughts, if God told them God so) God is all-powerful, yet he took 6 days to create the universe, then he rested.First contradiction, God is not omni-potent.God is all-loving, while gratacious evil still exists, therefore God is not all-loving, second contradiction.Thirdly, God never listens to me, EVER, and he never will, therefore he never listened to my cries for help, third contradiction, just plain ignoring me.

I would love theists to prove that the Easter bunny doesn't exist? Prove that Superman doesn't in fact exist, as well as Santa Clause? I've tried, and it's simply impossible.Maybe one day, God will make his presence known in the form of crazy homeless man, i'm sure that would be quite convincing, or at least more convincing than the stance he has provided as of late.Its sad that theists will continue to believe in a fiction, even when there is no supporting evidence to prove of Gods existance.

But I guess proof isn't needed either, as he MUST exist.

Its funny how a God only appears to a certain "believer", and then he disappears like smoke.Now that person is either highly delusional, or needs serious help, or both.I feel like puking now.

Regards

markfiend · 07-01-2003, 03:52 AM

The other planets are for other people! I'm looking forward to the day that the aliens really turn up and say, "Most of you people still believe in God? Wow you are primitive!"

Seriously, though, if there is intelligent life elsewhere in the universe, won't it throw a spanner in the works for Christianity? Unless Jesus came and died for the sins of the alien people on all their worlds too, how are they supposed to even know about him, never mind believe?

Or is the thought of the Son of God (TM) repeatedly suffering deaths and resurrections on world after world throughout the universe to be preferred?

07-01-2003, 03:52 AM	#50
markfiend Regular Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: The People's Republic of West Yorkshire Posts: 498	Hi I'm new The other planets are for other people! I'm looking forward to the day that the aliens really turn up and say, "Most of you people still believe in God? Wow you are primitive!" Seriously, though, if there is intelligent life elsewhere in the universe, won't it throw a spanner in the works for Christianity? Unless Jesus came and died for the sins of the alien people on all their worlds too, how are they supposed to even know about him, never mind believe? Or is the thought of the Son of God (TM) repeatedly suffering deaths and resurrections on world after world throughout the universe to be preferred?

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06-30-2003, 03:49 PM	#41
emotional Banned Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Boxing ring of HaShem, Jesus and Allah Posts: 1,945	I see no contradiction here.

06-30-2003, 03:51 PM	#42
NZAmoeba Regular Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: New Zealand Posts: 478	emotional... care to explain why god never thought to mention about all this wonderous creation? instead he seemed to have downplayed it a fair bit.... 'skydome' indeed!

06-30-2003, 09:46 PM	#47
wordsmyth Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Des Moines, Ia. U.S.A. Posts: 521	Let me see if I can formulate what the standard fundamentalist response usually is. Atheist: How can you believe the bible is the word of an all knowing God when it is filled with contradictions and absurdities? Theist: There are no contradictions or absurdities in the bible. Atheist: What about this passage here where it describes something that is clearly absurd and outright false? Theist: Its simple really. What the bible says and what it really means aren't the same thing. You aren't reading the bible the way it was intended. Here, take this bible and smack yourself in the head with it a few hundred times and the bibles true(tm) meaning will start to become clear. Atheist: Theist: Atheist: ... ok, so maybe thats not exactly the standard fundamentalist response, but its the general impression I always get.

06-30-2003, 10:26 PM	#48
ChrisW Junior Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: the moon Posts: 11	more like: Atheist: here's my big list of biblical contradictions [insert website here] Theist: here's my big list a refutations [insert website here] Atheist: well your refutations aren't good enough Theist: well your contradictions aren't good enough Enter bandwagon of theists or atheists (depending on the forum) Atheist or Theist feels vindicated because the majority agrees with them, they therefore won the debate. quite fun to watch really.

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