Freethought & Rationalism Archive

demoninho · 07-03-2003, 04:07 AM

Hi,
Does anyone have a suggestion on how to deconvert an evangelical xian? Are there any exxtians here who can tell me what started them to doubt, what was the seed that started your atheism?

After reading a lot and trying on other forums I found out scientific arguments don't work but what does work?

justwonder · 07-03-2003, 04:33 AM

Have them read the entire bible, front to back.

demoninho · 07-03-2003, 04:35 AM

Yeah, she did no contradictions there, all perfection and logic:banghead:

scarmig · 07-03-2003, 04:44 AM

Short answer: You can't.

Let me emphasize..

You can't. Only she can deconvert her. The best you can do is be available to offer alternative ideas in a nonjudgemental manner. You can lay the path before he, but she's the one that must walk it.

Godless Dave · 07-03-2003, 05:34 AM

What Scarmig said. People have to think their way to atheism on their own.

demoninho · 07-03-2003, 05:43 AM

Yeah, my conclusion too. But how do you start the thinking process? What made ex-xians start to think? How can you at least sow some doubt? Because on their own most of'm can't break out of their false logic.

Buddrow_Wilson · 07-03-2003, 06:46 AM

I have no idea how someone becomes one in the first place, and I would have no clue how to bring them back. I think maybe the best you can do is live a moral decent life without her religion, be a good friend, and possibly doubt will find its way in.

AspenMama · 07-03-2003, 07:09 AM

Well, you can train yourself to respond to typical arguments. Read through the materials here and check out some of the suggested books. Is your friend interested in discussions with you?A trip to a natural history musuem is a good way to initiate a discussion.

I echo everyone else when they say your friend must decide for him/herself and you need just to be there and be available to have discussions if he/she wants them.

demoninho · 07-03-2003, 07:39 AM

The problem is we life half a world apart (she in brazil and i in holland) but we do have a child together. My atheism is a not the only reason for us being apart but it is a major one. Communication is only via telephone and occasional mail. Incedently her family calls me demon (hence my nick: little demon in portuguese). So I want to make her start thinking without being to obvious because I noticed speaking with her and her family and other xians on other forums that being to open gets them in this defensive mode like "but you exist therefor god exist blablabla....and you need to open your heart to JC blablabla"

scarmig · 07-03-2003, 08:07 AM

Well, in my case I only started to doubt and question when I reached an emotional bottom. I had completed tapped all my "spiritual" reserves, to the point where I either had to doubt my religious beliefs, or contemplate suicide.

Once I made that choice (I'm still here!) things got much easier much faster.

07-03-2003, 04:07 AM	#1
demoninho Senior Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 927	The seed Hi, Does anyone have a suggestion on how to deconvert an evangelical xian? Are there any exxtians here who can tell me what started them to doubt, what was the seed that started your atheism? After reading a lot and trying on other forums I found out scientific arguments don't work but what does work?

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07-03-2003, 04:33 AM	#2
justwonder Regular Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: VA USA Posts: 172	Have them read the entire bible, front to back.

07-03-2003, 04:35 AM	#3
demoninho Senior Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 927	Yeah, she did no contradictions there, all perfection and logic:banghead:

07-03-2003, 04:44 AM	#4
scarmig Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Somewhere Posts: 689	Short answer: You can't. Let me emphasize.. You can't. Only she can deconvert her. The best you can do is be available to offer alternative ideas in a nonjudgemental manner. You can lay the path before he, but she's the one that must walk it.

07-03-2003, 05:34 AM	#5
Godless Dave Contributor Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: With 10,000 lakes who needs a coast? Posts: 10,762	What Scarmig said. People have to think their way to atheism on their own.

07-03-2003, 05:43 AM	#6
demoninho Senior Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 927	Yeah, my conclusion too. But how do you start the thinking process? What made ex-xians start to think? How can you at least sow some doubt? Because on their own most of'm can't break out of their false logic.

07-03-2003, 06:46 AM	#7
Buddrow_Wilson Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Arkansas Posts: 1,589	I have no idea how someone becomes one in the first place, and I would have no clue how to bring them back. I think maybe the best you can do is live a moral decent life without her religion, be a good friend, and possibly doubt will find its way in.

07-03-2003, 07:09 AM	#8
AspenMama Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Colorado Posts: 3,311	Well, you can train yourself to respond to typical arguments. Read through the materials here and check out some of the suggested books. Is your friend interested in discussions with you?A trip to a natural history musuem is a good way to initiate a discussion. I echo everyone else when they say your friend must decide for him/herself and you need just to be there and be available to have discussions if he/she wants them.

07-03-2003, 07:39 AM	#9
demoninho Senior Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 927	The problem is we life half a world apart (she in brazil and i in holland) but we do have a child together. My atheism is a not the only reason for us being apart but it is a major one. Communication is only via telephone and occasional mail. Incedently her family calls me demon (hence my nick: little demon in portuguese). So I want to make her start thinking without being to obvious because I noticed speaking with her and her family and other xians on other forums that being to open gets them in this defensive mode like "but you exist therefor god exist blablabla....and you need to open your heart to JC blablabla"

07-03-2003, 08:07 AM	#10
scarmig Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Somewhere Posts: 689	Well, in my case I only started to doubt and question when I reached an emotional bottom. I had completed tapped all my "spiritual" reserves, to the point where I either had to doubt my religious beliefs, or contemplate suicide. Once I made that choice (I'm still here!) things got much easier much faster.

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