King Rat

Oh Shit! DD I'm so sorry, I confused you with Magus55.

I sincerely, sincerely apologize.

Darth Dane

All is forgiven






DD - Love & Laughter

Biff the unclean

You might try following H.L. Mencken's advice "One horse-laugh is worth a thousand syllogisms."
I've noticed that many Xians who want to convert you demand respect for their beliefs while they are bashing yours. Perhaps if you found his "message" humorous he might take the hint.

Calzaer

Wuss.

Seriously, tho, I agree with HD. This man belongs to a broad group of people, who, on the whole, would rather we not exist at all. A significant number of them are willing to do whatever it takes to ensure we STOP existing, either through legal/legislative channels, hard-sell conversion tactics, or direct violence/threats of violence. While embracing them and starting a dialogue about good things and learning to live together in the loving grasp of the Bright Happy White Light might sound like a good idea, it's not really possible.

I would also like to pont out that I, for one, am not able to tolerate condescention based on how much I need to be saved, and you'll find only a rather small minority of Christians who won't engage in that sort of thing. Even if my rights are not being directly threatened or violated, I have a hard time dealing with people who obviously would rather I just lay down and die so they could laugh at my incorporal soul burning in a lake of fire. And all the serene dialogues in the world won't change a Christian's view on the need for salvation. Maybe I just need a thicker skin and become more accepting of people who would do their best to get me fired if their kids happened to be in a school I was working with.

Biff the unclean

You say that Christians arent going away and atheists are going away.

Ah yes, where is Sigmund Freud when we need him? Your slip is showing

Atheists, by the way, has a capital "A" just like Christians has a capital letter

Elbereth

I've gotten similar. You can try responding something like "I didn't ask" and can apply it to being created, being saved by Jesus, or anything else he thinks you should worship his God for apparently giving you.

Or you could just rephrase the question as "Why does your god want recognition?"

Rusting Car Bumper

You sound like a fundamentalist Christian.

That's not intended as an insult because that is exactly the the sort of thing a fundamentalist Chrsitian could say. That is the fundamentalist would insist there is nothing possibly in common. However, both the atheist and theist have many things in common. They both believe in justice and fairness. They both want their children to be safe. They want to live in peace and so on...

Have you stood in front of 1000 people in a fundamentalist church representing atheists? I have. When you have done that then get back to me on how naive I am.

You draw a circle and when you do so you put THEM outside the circle. However, you are trapped in it.

The fact is that it was only a few deades ago in America that African Americans (then "niggers" or "coloreds") were lazy, immoral, slothful, stupid, permiscious, and generally worthless. Now that has changed.

It was a few decades ago in America that gays and homosexuals were the bottom of the barrel scum feeders. Now look at them. They have a ways to go but no doubt tat this point they have made huge strides and continue to do so.

The only naive thing is to believe that willfull change is not possible.

DC

Rusting Car Bumper

Yes and that was true of blacks and gays as well and look where they have come today from where they were.

The only naive thing to believe is that change cannot happen.

Who said they have to be serene?

I frankly think that hate, and disrespect of them is narrow and foolish. It is merely becoming what one condemns. They are humans just like I am and they too wish to be treated with dignity and respect. Got a problem with that? How is fostering an attitude and taking up the very characteristics that we complain about in them going to help us?

DC

Heathen Dawn

I don't get your meaning. What do you mean by "1000 people in a fundamentalist church representing atheists"? Do you mean there are that many atheists in the churches? Please clarify.

Theists have different presuppositions than atheists, they look at the world in a totally different way. For example, sickness in atheist eyes is a purely natural phenomenon, while theists see it also as divine retribution. History is interpreted differently. The goal of life is different. Beyond plain business (buying and selling), I can't have any talk with theists in my country.

Rusting Car Bumper

I mean I practice what I preach. I was invited to a fundamentalist church to represent atheism and I stood in front of 1000 of them and did exactly that. I did not argue theology but instead demonstrated through presence and behavior that atheists are concerned about the same things as themselves.

And you know what... I had dozens of them crowding me afterward telling me they never understood these viewpoints, they never realized that atheists had a hard time and so on. Hell, I even got the Christian ministry representitive to say "Atheists can be moral people" to the entire f***ing fundamentalist church!

...or would I have done better debating some minutiae about intelligent design?

In a word... bullshit.

I live in area of the bible belt that is predominently Christian yet the hospitals are full of them getting x-rays, antibiotics, surgery and the like. The fact is they all demand the same naturalistic medicine as the rest of us. Ask any of them NOT to seek treatment, call an ambulance and so on and they will think you are a crackpot.

I am not in your country and my comments apply only to my own. Any ideas regarding this are only meant to apply to American culture.

DC