FRDB Archives

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.


Go Back   FRDB Archives > Archives > IIDB ARCHIVE: 200X-2003, PD 2007 > IIDB Philosophical Forums (PRIOR TO JUN-2003)
Welcome, Peter Kirby.
You last visited: Today at 05:55 AM

 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 03-19-2003, 11:42 PM   #11
Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Scotland, UK
Posts: 602
Default Amos, let me repost my poetic version

Thoughts of An Ancient Farmer

Salty sweat drips from my burning brow
As I strain in the dust behind this plow.
The Sun is bright, the air hot as Hell.
Why I breathe this dust, none can tell.

I cough and ask the gods, “Why oh Why?”
So I gaze into the glare of the empty sky.
Am I punished for some bloody crime
That I can’t recall in this dust and grime?

It must have been a foul sin before my time
By my father, or his, in a past gentle clime.
The sin angered the gods to such cruel rage;
They burned the garden of the Golden Age.

Man and woman were sent into dusty fields,
To scratch the dry soil for meagre yields.
“By the sweat of your brow shall ye struggle to live,”
Said the gods without love or mercy to give.

I asked the shaman about the ancient fall.
“How did our father degrade us all?”
Moses the shaman, told us the story
Of Adam’s sin and his fall from glory.

Adam said, “she, the law first did break
When the fruit of knowledge she did take.”
Eve sought truths that the gods deny,
Good and evil, and the first great lie.

They lied that gods made us from mud,
Slime and dust, spit and crud.
They lied about our majestic source,
Fearing our leaning the truth, of course.

Gods said magic words, arcane chants,
Animated mud became man without pants.
Shamans in their arrogance and bluff
Deny that we are ancient star stuff.

In future we’ll avenge slandered Eve
Using complex brains we did receive.
There is no god but Gaia, our mother,
Earth, visible and real, and no other.

Our complex brains Gaia made us evolve
By climate shifts, thinking minds to solve
Alleles, markers, and nucleotide codes,
Translocations, repeats, and deletion modes.

She evolved our complex frontal lobes
To send into the cosmos, intelligent probes.
Finding our beginnings in a proto-star core,
A supernova blast, and then we did soar.

Protons fused into atoms of Hydrogen,
Carbon, Oxygen, Sulphur, and Nitrogen.
Off into space they sped trillions of miles.
‘Till gravity collected them into dense piles.

Big piles ignited nuclear-fuelled suns.
Little piles made planets in orbital runs.
One watery planet made life in a mix,
Molecules bonding a double helix.

The helix bonds lysed and translocated.
Alleles deleted, repeated, and mutated.
Mutation to mutation made most die out.
But some adapted to walk, think, and shout.

Large frontal lobes discovered our kin,
Amoeba, worm, lungfish, and lobefin,
Kangaroo, primate, ape, and mankind.
Gaia evolved our inquisitive mind.

Here comes that shaman to brow beat
My tired body in this burning heat.
”Thank god for not making your toils
Even worse here as your sinful flesh broils.”

The shaman tells me I will go up there,
To grovel for gods who didn’t care.
From this dusty field I’ll get no relief.
Yet no shaman’s lie will be my belief.

A glob of mud was not my sire.
Eve sought the truth that we all desire.
Our atoms burst from a giant star core.
Across space we sped, 10 billion years more.

We’re not magic mud, not conjured by gods.
We’re star stuff, from a journey against odds.
We formed planets and bonded molecules who
Stood up, thought, and sought what is true.

Domhnall MacPherson © (Fiach)
Fiach is offline  
Old 03-19-2003, 11:46 PM   #12
Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Scotland, UK
Posts: 602
Default Re: Re: The Soul Hypothesis and God invention

Quote:
Originally posted by Amos
Not at all, Fiach and you are way off the mark here. I will argue that just the opposite is true.

The primitive man was God and if banned from Eden (when he became a rational agent) he was never far from Eden and not much was required to get back into Eden. Understand here that we are only distant from Eden by the size of our ego awareness and so little ego's do not have much to lose by sacrificing their ego to get back into heaven. The problem with this is that little ego's make for little heavens because we must 'color' our own heaven while we are on earth and we do this during the first half of our life (yang period) so we can enjoy this same during the second half (yin period). Since they, the primitives were always close to Eden, it was easier for them to "see spirits" which in turn is why educated people as less troubled by the spirit world (until they have a NDE, I guess).

If their ego was little their 'creations' were also small and so there was not much to be enjoyed in their heaven except peace of mind (which, of course, is good enough for anybody). The point here is that while in heaven we also benefit from the accumilated wisdom of our forefathers that is retained in our soul for up to one thousand years. Again, if their heaven was also small there was not much to be learned from that either . . . , nor was there a large amount of illumination to draw from during the yang period of life (understand here that we are omniscient in our subconscious mind and must get our inspirations from our own mind).

Primitive mythologies have primitive Gods because the Thousand Year Reign is part of our life in heaven during which time our soul is part of our conscious awareness (intuit memory is also rational memory in heaven due to the convergence of our twain mind).

The problem increases when our ego is big and when much more rational knowlegde is retained in the conscious mind. We then have 'much to lose' and are much more reluctant to let go of that which has made us the man we are [until this very day]. To overcome this "indulgences" were used as leverage to help strip humans of their ego identity. The were very successful and the proof of this is that they were popular during the heyday of Catholicism.

You should not lose sight of the fact that we, each one of us, can be God and if that is still true today it was also true then. With a singular mind 'dreaming' is not possible and if, as I hold that heaven is to be of a singular mind, dreaming should not be possible during the yen period. Therefore the OT passage "it is an evil age when old men have dreams" is true.
I am not going to answer your post point by point. In fact, I don't know what you are actually saying much of the post. It may be cultural, but most of it lost me. I will have to print it out and read it over very slowly and try to translate it into UK English. I do appreciate the work and effort in your post. I will try to get a handle on it.

Fiach
Fiach is offline  
Old 03-19-2003, 11:59 PM   #13
Cthulhu
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Wink Re: Re: Re: The Soul Hypothesis and God invention

Quote:
Originally posted by Fiach
In fact, I don't know what you are actually saying much of the post.
Trust me, don't even try. Just smile and nod like the rest of us.
 
Old 03-20-2003, 02:49 PM   #14
Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Scotland, UK
Posts: 602
Default Re: Re: Re: Re: The Soul Hypothesis and God invention

Quote:
Originally posted by Cthulhu
Trust me, don't even try. Just smile and nod like the rest of us.
Hmmmm.

Fiach
Fiach is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 06:30 PM.

Top

This custom BB emulates vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.