AJ113

I didn't say that it proves he leads an irrational life! I was merely replying to your post! another strawman!

And you have dismissed his accomplishments......

No I haven't! What do you mean by this? It's yet another strawman!

which leads me to believe that you do not consider that deeds are a demonstration of someone's rationality. Or are deeds a demonstration of someone's rationality? I believe they are.

How about all the deeds that go hand-in-hand with a self-confessed irrational religeous belief? Like praying, going to church, making a sign of the cross? Besides, the very act of holding a belief is a deed.

Are you attempting to differentiate between physical and mental actions?

AJ113

So you are saying that having exposed a significant area of an individual's life as being irrational, we can offset that irrationality by exposing other areas of that individual's life that are rational? As though one somehow cancels out the other?

I frequently spend hours banging my head against a brick wall. I don't know why I do it, I certainly know it's irrational, but don't declare me an irrational person - I always put a bandage on afterwards, and that cancels out my irrationality.

AJ113

Or people may attempt to cover up their irrational decisions by labelling them "intuitive."

Even if the point is conceded, it does not address the case of an individual who makes an irrational choice, admits that the choice is irrational, and then continues with the choice anyway.

Source: Cambridge Dictionaries Online:
logic (REASONABLE THINKING) noun [U]
a particular way of thinking, especially one which is reasonable and based on good judgment:

Looks to me like "logic" and "reason" are pretty much interchangeable.

AJ113

And, AFAIK, no one here has disagreed with you.

And you have not shown that holding an irrational religious belief is a special case.

Because it isn't.

Bumble Bee Tuna

Not at all. My definition is the only real useful one. If you take yours, which is the equivalent of "makes rational decisions a majority of the time", then EVERYONE is rational. Who doesn't usually make rational decisions? Every day yields hundreds of decisions, and most all of them are made rationally. (should I go through that yellow light? well, it's been yellow for 3 seconds, so no, I should stop, it's about to be red)
For someone to meaningfully be described as "rational", it must be an instrinsic part of their nature. They don't just usually make rational decisions. They try to make sure ALL their decisions are rational. This is the only way you can make the word meaningful.

I've shown that holding an irrational belief is not equivalent to being generally irrational. You keep saying "oh, but RBAC is 'generally rational'!" News flash: Everyone is generally rational.

Forgive me if I don't understand what you're talking about. Religions beliefs AREN'T special cases- They make you an irrational person just like any other irrational decisions. It is you who would be wanting to claim they were special cases.

-B

Bumble Bee Tuna

Yes, because nobody in the whole world is irrational in general. Anyone who would be would be weeded out, because if the majority of your decisions are irrational soon you'll be dead from a bad one.

Meanwhile, A decision based on "intuitive reasons" is highly irrational. Everyone makes decisions based on some sort of reasons. We call the decisions irrational if the reasons don't make sense (and intuitive reasons would certainly fit the bill).

Reason is the process of using logic to come to a conclusion.

-B

Bumble Bee Tuna

For the third last time :

Just because someone is irrational doesn't mean all their decisions in life are irrational! How many times must I say this before you pay attention? Nobody is dismissing RBAC's accomplishments! Nobody is saying RBAC always makes irrational decisions! Do you ever pay attention? At all? I have seriously repeated myself at least 3 times on the subject.

Being rational is an intrinsic quality. If someone is irrational at all, including their faith, they cannot be an innately rational person. A rational person might mistakenly make an irrational decision and regret it, but he won't make one and think it was good after the fact.

-B

Nowhere357

There are no generally irrational people in the world? Then everyone must be generally rational.

We all have our irrational moments, so none of us are "innately" rational.

I really think these definitions aren't very useful.

Rational BAC

I am glad you all all are enjoying this thread.

Me too.

Bumble Bee Tuna

Exactly! Generally irrational people die out. Irrational people can successfully compartmentalize their irrationality, but it doesn't make them rational. Except by your meaningless definition.

I guess you would, if you ignored the many, many times I said "A rational person might mistakenly make an irrational decision and regret it, but he won't make one and think it was good after the fact."
I feel like I'm talking to a brick wall here.

-B