Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Seeker196 · 05-25-2003, 09:14 AM

I consider myself a 'freethinker'. (I think everyone does don't they?)

I'm 'agnostic' about non-material things.

I'm atheist on the Judeo-Christian god.

But I'm not yet comfortable with being a total strict materialist. The rational part of me is saying: Don't you realize that an 'immaterial thing' is a contradiction? Don't be a tard!!

But the irrational part of me feels like that guy that Sigmund Freud rebuts at the beginning of Civilization and its Discontents, the one who doesn't believe in god, but yet feels...a sort of 'mm-mmm', a 'magical maybe-ness' about existing (and I know all humans are genetically predisposed to magical thinking). Freud's colleague called it an 'indescribeable, vast, oceanic feeling'.

I don't believe in a Sky-Daddy, a hell, a god-written absolute moral code, or existence as a big stupid cosmic farce between Good and Evil.

But I'm still not comfortable with calling myself an 'atheist' yet because of this 'X' feeling.

Can I still consider myself part of these august ranks??

This has to be the stupidest thread ever.

Jewel · 05-25-2003, 10:03 AM

Don't be so hard on yourself. A label is not mandatory.

cjack · 05-25-2003, 11:10 AM

I'm right there with you, Seeker.

"Atheist" is just a label, and IMHO, doesn't do a very good job as such.

Add to that the fact that believers have managed to attach a negative connotation to the word, and I can totally understand why you would feel as you do. I sometimes feel that way too!

the_cave · 05-25-2003, 11:22 AM

Not all atheists are materialists.

True fact.

So you can feel free to call yourself whatever you like

In fact, you don't even have to call yourself an atheist...you could try and come up with something more descriptive of your beliefs, if you want. Or not, if you want.

Ultimate Atheist · 05-25-2003, 12:45 PM

Atheists are one of the last groups that are shunned and mistreated. Maybe if more people admitted that they were atheists and stood up for themselves that would change. There's nothing wrong with calling yourself an atheist. If you don't believe in gods then you are not a theist , therefore you are an atheist regardless of whether you decide to call yourself one or not.

At the same time you should be careful with telling everyone you know that you're an atheist. I've seen it cost people their jobs or relationships. The best thing to do is seek out like minded people. We're everywhere. We're just hard to spot in a crowd.

pariah · 05-25-2003, 12:53 PM

atheism can either be a lack of beleif or a positive disbeleif.

you have a positive disbeleif in judeochristianity.

you have a lack of beleif of anything else.

from what you have said, you are an atheist.

Overgrowngoblin · 05-25-2003, 01:13 PM

Could you more fully describe this �X� feeling that you�ve mentioned?

Foofer · 05-25-2003, 01:53 PM

The fact that the religious have negative connotations of the word "atheist" is the reason I call myself an atheist. I don't like the idea of people that don't understand a word re-defining it for me.

Viti · 05-25-2003, 01:58 PM

Hubby and I discussed labels (loudly and for a long time) just the other night. I consider "atheist" and "humanist" as descriptive and convenient, he sees them as "boxing people in".

He refuses to accept a label...so you don't have to use atheist if you don't want to...

The Other Michael · 05-25-2003, 02:27 PM

Hello LadyShea

In re "boxing in", does your spouse feel boxed in by "hubby"?

We of course need to make sure the term adequately describes the object. If "atheist" is only 60% accurate, then another term may need to be found, or the term modified by descriptive adjectives.

But if "humanist" is 85% accurate, it may be "good enough" for day to day use, and only need to be modified if a situation arises where you need to a high degree of accuracy.

I find it interesting that non-theists may be more nitpicky about the terminology applied to them, where theists (Christians for example) seem quite willing to take the broad label and apply it to themselves, even though what they actually believe may be radically different from someone else who also accepts the same label.

I suspect that the negative connations atheist has been given by the theists has a lot to do with it.

cheers,
Michael

05-25-2003, 09:14 AM	#1
Seeker196 Regular Member Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Canada Posts: 278	Not Comfortable Yet with the 'A' Word I consider myself a 'freethinker'. (I think everyone does don't they?) I'm 'agnostic' about non-material things. I'm atheist on the Judeo-Christian god. But I'm not yet comfortable with being a total strict materialist. The rational part of me is saying: Don't you realize that an 'immaterial thing' is a contradiction? Don't be a tard!! But the irrational part of me feels like that guy that Sigmund Freud rebuts at the beginning of Civilization and its Discontents, the one who doesn't believe in god, but yet feels...a sort of 'mm-mmm', a 'magical maybe-ness' about existing (and I know all humans are genetically predisposed to magical thinking). Freud's colleague called it an 'indescribeable, vast, oceanic feeling'. I don't believe in a Sky-Daddy, a hell, a god-written absolute moral code, or existence as a big stupid cosmic farce between Good and Evil. But I'm still not comfortable with calling myself an 'atheist' yet because of this 'X' feeling. Can I still consider myself part of these august ranks?? This has to be the stupidest thread ever.

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version	Search this Thread: Advanced Search

05-25-2003, 10:03 AM	#2
Jewel Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Northern Virginia, USA Posts: 1,112	Don't be so hard on yourself. A label is not mandatory.

05-25-2003, 11:10 AM	#3
cjack Banned Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Arizona Posts: 4,294	I'm right there with you, Seeker. "Atheist" is just a label, and IMHO, doesn't do a very good job as such. Add to that the fact that believers have managed to attach a negative connotation to the word, and I can totally understand why you would feel as you do. I sometimes feel that way too!

05-25-2003, 11:22 AM	#4
the_cave Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Earth Posts: 1,443	Not all atheists are materialists. True fact. So you can feel free to call yourself whatever you like In fact, you don't even have to call yourself an atheist...you could try and come up with something more descriptive of your beliefs, if you want. Or not, if you want.

05-25-2003, 12:45 PM	#5
Ultimate Atheist Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Here Posts: 980	Atheists are one of the last groups that are shunned and mistreated. Maybe if more people admitted that they were atheists and stood up for themselves that would change. There's nothing wrong with calling yourself an atheist. If you don't believe in gods then you are not a theist , therefore you are an atheist regardless of whether you decide to call yourself one or not. At the same time you should be careful with telling everyone you know that you're an atheist. I've seen it cost people their jobs or relationships. The best thing to do is seek out like minded people. We're everywhere. We're just hard to spot in a crowd.

05-25-2003, 12:53 PM	#6
pariah Banned Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: الرياض Posts: 6,456	atheism can either be a lack of beleif or a positive disbeleif. you have a positive disbeleif in judeochristianity. you have a lack of beleif of anything else. from what you have said, you are an atheist.

05-25-2003, 01:13 PM	#7
Overgrowngoblin Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Shooting dice in a crater on the Moon Posts: 501	Could you more fully describe this �X� feeling that you�ve mentioned?

05-25-2003, 01:53 PM	#8
Foofer Regular Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Behind the hot water pipes, third washroom along, Victoria Station Posts: 268	The fact that the religious have negative connotations of the word "atheist" is the reason I call myself an atheist. I don't like the idea of people that don't understand a word re-defining it for me.

05-25-2003, 01:58 PM	#9
Viti Contributor Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Down South Posts: 12,879	Hubby and I discussed labels (loudly and for a long time) just the other night. I consider "atheist" and "humanist" as descriptive and convenient, he sees them as "boxing people in". He refuses to accept a label...so you don't have to use atheist if you don't want to...

05-25-2003, 02:27 PM	#10
The Other Michael Honorary Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: In the fog of San Francisco Posts: 12,631	Hello LadyShea In re "boxing in", does your spouse feel boxed in by "hubby"? We of course need to make sure the term adequately describes the object. If "atheist" is only 60% accurate, then another term may need to be found, or the term modified by descriptive adjectives. But if "humanist" is 85% accurate, it may be "good enough" for day to day use, and only need to be modified if a situation arises where you need to a high degree of accuracy. I find it interesting that non-theists may be more nitpicky about the terminology applied to them, where theists (Christians for example) seem quite willing to take the broad label and apply it to themselves, even though what they actually believe may be radically different from someone else who also accepts the same label. I suspect that the negative connations atheist has been given by the theists has a lot to do with it. cheers, Michael

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.