Jamie_L

Alonzo:
Excellent post, and I agree wholeheartedly. I'm not really a proponent of the kind of self-interest morality you propose. In my first post on this thread, I was suggesting that people generally do things to help themselves even if they sometimes don't realize it or think that way.

You are right, however, that we all have instinctive processes that are based on protecting the "gene" more than ourselves. I was kind of lumping that in with "self-interest" in my head, if not explicitly in my posts.

To the rest of you: "Yeah. What Alonzo said."

Jamie

Alonzo Fyfe

I am pleased that you agree with the content of the post.

However, your post contains a small mis-statement I feel compelled to correct.

Maybe you did not type what you wanted to type, or I am not interpreting this correctly, but I propose no self-interest morality. Quite the opposite, in fact.

[ July 15, 2002: Message edited by: Alonzo Fyfe ]</p>

Jamie_L

Alonzo:
Just poor word choice. I meant that I was not proposing the kind of self-interest morality you were describing (and ascribing to me).

Carry on.

Jamie

Keith Russell

Greetings:

This was proposed:
"Do anything that will help you.
Manipulate others' minds to achieve this by acting loving, friendly, or kind. Do everything for yourself, and appear sincere. Manipulate your own mind by convincing yourself that whatever your current goal is is right."

The primary concern here, despite first glance, it that it is primarily concerned with others. Manipulate others' minds...appear sincere [to those around you].

This seems to be a self-centered thesis, but the focus is that decieving others is good for one's self, that others are required for one's own happiness, and that these others won't be interested in helping one's own self, unless they are manipulated, cajoled, and/or tricked into doing it.

What a horrible view of life, from either the perspective of the 'one', or of the 'others'.

Ayn Rand noted that if others are a value to me, helping them might very well be in my own interest. Also, there might be plenty of people who are not of value to me, and thus I need concern myself with them not at all.

I agree that my primary concern should be for myself, for my own rationally-chosen interests. But, I cannot see how that translates into constantly thinking about how best to manipulate others into working toward my own ends.

I can take care of myself, primarily by myself.

Keith.