Freethought & Rationalism Archive

SignOfTheCross · 08-14-2003, 06:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by markfiend
By this argument gravity cannot be taught as a fact, because gravity, too, is not proven. No scientific theory can ever be proven 100%, only disproven by evidence that contradicts the theory.

Gravity can be tested and demonstrated. It is not the same as evolution.

Quote:

This doesn't stop NASA from using the theory of gravity to predict the orbits of the Space Shuttle, because there is no evidence that contradicts gravity (unless you get to a significant proportion of the speed of light, or other situations in which relativity theory is a closer approximation than Newtonian gravity, such as the orbit of Mercury)

Gravity is not the same as evolution. I don't challenge the notion of gravity.

Quote:

Similarly, there is no evidence that contradicts evolution. It is "just a theory", true, but a very well attested one, and almost everyone involved in biological science accepts it as a fact. If this were not the case, there would effectively be no biological sciences. [/B]

There are many different theories of evolution, not just one. Furthermore, until we can "observe" evolution take place, we cannot teach it as fact, no matter how plausible it is. I fully encourage evolution being taught in our schools, but I don't know why some people aren't willing to question it, not even a little.

Peace,
SOTC

Selsaral · 08-14-2003, 06:24 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Milton
Always the same silly response.

I can feel gravity, but I can't see this so darwinian evolution you speak of.

If you studied biology you would. If you went to your local limestone quarry you would.

Milton · 08-14-2003, 06:56 AM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by CaptainOfOuterSpace
[B]What a coincidence; I can't see this "god" you speak of!

Quote:

Some scientific theories are more complex than others. Not all theories apply only to things that can be "seen." For example, the fact that the Earth is spherical is very counter-intuitive (on a small scale, it feels suspiciously flat). That's why it took centuries for people to come to grips with this fact. It's only a matter of time for evolution, as well.

BTW, there's just about as much evidence against evolution as there is against a spherical earth.

You mean to say that those pics of earth from outerspace are fake?

Heathen Dawn · 08-14-2003, 07:14 AM

*sigh*

You really don't have to go as far as fossils and molecular lab tests in order to confirm evolution. All you need is two good eyes to look at some weird designs in nature that don't make sense for an intelligent designer.

An example (my favorite one): on the human calf there is a muscle called the Plantaris. It also exists on the calf of apes. The difference between the Plantaris in humans and apes is its functionality. In humans, the Plantaris muscle is atrophied; it doesn't do anything, except for giving you pain if it's torn by accident. In apes it is functional; it serves to flex all toes at once, a very useful feature for swinging between trees.

Question: why would an intelligent designer give us an unfunctioning muscle that functions in apes? Could it be ... shudders ... that we and the apes evolved from a common ancestor, and the Plantaris muscle was functional in us humans as well, but became atrophied when we stopped swinging between trees? Well, what makes more sense? Blind, unplanning evolution (with its potential for leftover parts) or stupid design? You decide.

CaptainOfOuterSpace · 08-14-2003, 07:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Milton
You mean to say that those pics of earth from outerspace are fake?

If you're Christian enough, you should argue that they're faked, and that the Biblical flat/dome earth is true. Flat-earthers, when it comes to Biblical adherence, are the truest Christians of them all.

markfiend · 08-14-2003, 07:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Milton
You mean to say that those pics of earth from outerspace are fake?

And this is the only way a creationist can "prove" their case. Denial of the existence of evidence does not mean that the evidence is not there. :banghead:

*edit to add:

Quote:

Originally posted by Wyz_sub10
Feel free to make this argument in the Evolution/Creation forum...

I second that motion.

SaintCaffeine · 08-14-2003, 07:24 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by SignOfTheCross
Evolution is not a scientific fact, it is not proven, I don't think it ever will be. All scientific theories require a certain element of faith, but as plausible as they may seem, until they are proven they should never be taught as fact, or used to "prove" other arguements wrong.

Please consider this -

�God is not a scientific fact, he has not been proven, I don�t think he ever will be. All religious beliefs require a certain element of faith, but as plausible as they may seem, until they are proven they should never be taught as fact, or used to �prove� other arguments wrong.�

Sign of The Cross, thank you for participating in this forum. Everyone here is searching for truth, and if any argument resonates with our empirical and experiential understanding of reality, than we would all have to consider its merit. So your comments help all of us, including yourself, gain a broader collective pool of possibilities to consider. Thank you.

SignOfTheCross · 08-14-2003, 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by SaintCaffeine
Please consider this -

�God is not a scientific fact, he has not been proven, I don�t think he ever will be. All religious beliefs require a certain element of faith, but as plausible as they may seem, until they are proven they should never be taught as fact, or used to �prove� other arguments wrong.�

Sign of The Cross, thank you for participating in this forum. Everyone here is searching for truth, and if any argument resonates with our empirical and experiential understanding of reality, than we would all have to consider its merit. So your comments help all of us, including yourself, gain a broader collective pool of possibilities to consider. Thank you.

Why is it everytime a Christian makes an arguement an opportunistic atheist is quick to insert the word "God" in there???

In response to what you wrote, I wouldn't limit God to a scientific fact.

Peace,
SOTC

BlessNot · 08-14-2003, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Supercaliber
What would happen if the whole world converted to atheism tomorrow?..How would the world proceed?

It would probably be the beginning of the end of all wars.

Milton · 08-14-2003, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by CaptainOfOuterSpace
If you're Christian enough, you should argue that they're faked, and that the Biblical flat/dome earth is true. Flat-earthers, when it comes to Biblical adherence, are the truest Christians of them all.

strange... i thought a christian was a follower of Jesus Christ...

(Christian, get it?)

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08-14-2003, 07:14 AM	#34
Heathen Dawn Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 4,656	sigh You really don't have to go as far as fossils and molecular lab tests in order to confirm evolution. All you need is two good eyes to look at some weird designs in nature that don't make sense for an intelligent designer. An example (my favorite one): on the human calf there is a muscle called the Plantaris. It also exists on the calf of apes. The difference between the Plantaris in humans and apes is its functionality. In humans, the Plantaris muscle is atrophied; it doesn't do anything, except for giving you pain if it's torn by accident. In apes it is functional; it serves to flex all toes at once, a very useful feature for swinging between trees. Question: why would an intelligent designer give us an unfunctioning muscle that functions in apes? Could it be ... shudders ... that we and the apes evolved from a common ancestor, and the Plantaris muscle was functional in us humans as well, but became atrophied when we stopped swinging between trees? Well, what makes more sense? Blind, unplanning evolution (with its potential for leftover parts) or stupid design? You decide.

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