Jobar

1. I am incredulous that God doesn't exist.
2. Therefore, God exists.

Is this one on the list? I'm sure it is...

Ion

I agree.
However, 'real', 'imaginary', 'rational', 'irrational' numbers are misnomers for concepts in mapping nature into human symbols.
All theories based on the definitions of these concepts, are internally coherent.
Mageth and Jobar gave you two good answers.

However, I go along with your invitation, and once you get me rolling on examples is hard to stop, given the Bible's naivete:
1) In Genesis 1:31, I read:
"Then God saw that everything that He had made, and indeed it was very good.".
However for 834 pages following this statement, I read a cacophony of screw-ups, including 'sin'.
So, 'God' defined in the Bible as having created the universe from scratch which "...was very good.", in fact didn't 'create' something "...very good.".
2) In Matt 16:26 I read:
"Assuredly, I say to you, there are some standing here who shall not taste death till they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom.".
Nobody from 2000 years ago is still standing in the world, everybody did taste death, but no Son of 'God' ever came.
Everything claimed in the 'divinely-inspired' Bible being how 'God' is defined, false statements like this one disprove 'God''s existence.

There are plenty of such examples, almost on every page.

Tristan Scott

Ion,

All you are proving is that the Tanakh and Bible are packed with bullshit. None of this proves the non-existence of any gods.

You can't prove that gods don't exist any more than you can prove that the tooth fairy or Santa Claus don't exist.

Mageth

1) Definition: Santa Claus is a rather plump, jolly man with a white beard and a red nose and dressed up in a red suit who rides around the world on Christmans Eve in a sleigh pulled by magic flying reindeer sliding down chimneys and delivering presents to all the good boys and girls.

2) My son was a good boy last year.

3) We have a chimney.

4) I stayed up all of Christmas Eve assembling toys at my house and never saw Santa Claus coming down our chimney or heard anything on my roof.

5) In fact, I placed the presents under the tree myself.

6) Therefore, the Santa Claus as defined in 1) does not exist.

And this wasn't the first time I repeated this experiment. I've done it often over the years.

Tristan Scott

Mageth,

Your experiment does not prove that Santa Claus does not exist, it only proves that the myth about him is not accurate.

Philosoft

You are going to great lengths to make a truly miniscule point. Of course one can simply change the definition of the entity in question and then claim the proof is invalid. That's why sound proofs require well-defined terms. You can challenge the soundness of Mageth's proof by challenging the accuracy of his definition but you cannot declare a conditional proof prima facie unsound in this manner. Assuming the entity in Mageth's definition exists as defined, his proof is sound. QED.

Mageth

Thanks, Philosoft. <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" />

That's my point, TS, it's possible to disprove something when that something is well-defined.

Ion

I disagree Tristan.

Let's take again the example of 'God' defined in the Bible:
every claim made in the Bible, defines how 'God' is;
* if the claims are true, then 'God' exists;
* if the claims are false, then 'God' doesn't exist;
almost every page of the Bible, has false claims about how that 'God' is.

I gave in my previous post two false claims about how 'God' is.

Tristan Scott

Philosoft,

No doubt it is truly miniscule to you. The point is that you and many of the other's here are so smug in your certainty that you lose sight of the fact that supernatural entities have the luxury of being immune from being disproven, unlike corporeal entities that we can either prove or disprove. You only show me that you are as bigotted in your belief as many theists are. Bigotted to the point where simple reason escapes you.

I don't believe in any gods but I certainly cannot rule out the possibility that they could exist in some form or another, while you, on the other hand, limit yourself to the narrow little questions that you can easily find answers for.

Tristan Scott

Please Mageth, now you are saying that the god of Abraham is well defined? I thought you were the expert in showing how ill defined it was.