Jack the Bodiless

What a peculiar fantasy world you live in, Farseeker. Were you here when those events happened? Was this website here when those events happened? Are you seriously suggesting that the people now here would not have condemned those actions? Are you seriously suggesting that because I have not started a thread specifically to condemn those actions, then I approve of them?
Those who "don't believe in evolutionism" are scientifically incompetent. Naturally, this should make them ineligible for a variety of jobs. Just how many airline pilots and naval captains are flat-Earthers? Don't you think this might cause problems?
Christianity teaches only that murder is wrong, where murder is defined as unlawful killing ("Thou shalt not kill" is more properly translated "thou shalt not murder"). Unfortunately for you, Jesus failed to renounce the Old Testament: God commands the total genocidal slaughter of enemies. Atheism simply does not address this issue.
...Really? He claimed to be, and his actions were entirely in accord with Old Testament principles of genocide. He also blamed the Jews for killing Jesus and claimed to be "doing the Lord's work" in killing them.
Are you aware that the indentured servants were mostly treated worse than the slaves? And in what sense was the treatment of slaves "un-Biblical"?
And thousands of atheists died in the Gulags.

Look up the word "hypocrisy" in a dictionary, Farseeker.
Yes, you will always believe this. No matter how many atrocities Christians carry out, or how many peaceful democratic atheist-dominated governments exist. This is your dogma, and you're sticking to it.
<img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" /> <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" /> <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" />

Datheron

So let me get this straight.

When atheists "go bad" and commit crimes of atrocity, it's under some "atheist doctrine" which, as far as I know, does not exist and is hardly standard. The fact that we are not active in condemning such monstrosities done decades ago proves that we actually are in support.

When Christians "go bad" and commit crimes of atrocity, when it's known that the Christian doctrine was a catalyst in the crime, it is ruled that the criminals in fact did not follow the doctrine. The fact that no theist is also active in condemning these monstrosities, also performed ages ago, proves that they are in fact secretly condemning the dissectors.

Yes, we all love the double standard.

FarSeeker

<img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" />

Yes, the great one has spoken, let his word go forth and not be questioned!

<a href="http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/jeff_lowder/craig-jesseph.html" target="_blank">http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/jeff_lowder/craig-jesseph.html</a>
Hey, Someone questioned your statement of faith, oh no!

Don't try to put that shield up, I've heard it before. This is not a Confucian or Buddhist site. As for SecHum-ism, that is what the USSR called itself. Go figure. But please note the Sec Hum-ists have been demanding that all public schools indoctrinate all students into Sec Hum-ism's beliefs. Now I wonder why they are so dead set against private and home schooling?

As for skeptics, are they skeptical of their skepticism of their skepticism of their skepticism of their skepticism of their ...?

FarSeeker

Who said any Atheist "went bad"? They were just following their own human reasoning. On the other hand, Atheists in China are still killing "religionists" as you call them (Christians and Falun Gong members}, and you only object to one Atheist on death row on this site's home page. OOOOW, that's an even-handed approach.

Atheists play by the double standard, you fall by the double standard. But then again, let's hear your claims more specifically. But don't think I didn't catch your little word trick there, "catalyst" huh? Anything can be a catalyst. But hey, if you can condemn Christians today for the crusades 600 to 800 years ago or the Holocaust 50 yrs ago, why can't I condemn you for Atheists' atrocities just a few years ago? Looks like you just stuck your own double standard in you eye there.


[ February 17, 2002: Message edited by: FarSeeker ]</p>

Technos

Clearly you aren't too familiar with the history of rome. Their's was a civilization where the few ruled over the many, as the gap between the rich and those in absolute poverty grew so that the rich would have the poor killed for even speaking with them. Those who were in poverty were often slaves and in late Rome they would be treated with increasing cruelty if they even so much as looked at their masters, who were more like the Christians of America's middle age than like the modern day pagans who are constantly taking part in activism for American equality. The only people free in rome were the extremely wealthy who owned property, and they were very few in numbers.

Technos

Farseeker, don't insult the Atheist of America by comparing us to the government worshiping Matrixist of communist Russia. They may not have believed in gods, but they just replaced one object of worship with another. Besides there were many Catholic Communist as well, or did you skip your world history lessons?

Something you should learn is that Atheism itself has no underlying principles, so the actions of one group of Atheist in no way represent the views or ideals held by another group of Atheist. Most Atheist in America are democrats and capitalist, as well as humanist, a far cry from those idiots who sought to participate in ethnic cleansing and the dehumanization of the people (something avidly supported by many christians to this day I might add).

<img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" />

Technos

PS: How about the Slavery and dehumanization of blacks and women during the rule of those "christians" you speak of? During the great civil rights movement which in many ways is still alive today we have reached the peak of human civilization, far surpassing any nation in history. Do you think that Christians have full responsibility for this?

PSS: I must ask if you can recognize what religious group is most avidly against American equality to this day, and what group of people most avidly opposes technological progress in the fields of medicine and space exploration, as well as Biology. Excluding Islam of course. So tell me, aside from Islam which religion in America is the most opposed to the equal rights of Homosexuals, other races, other religions (such as paganism for instance), and which in America most avidly opposes Stem Cell research, the colonization of space and mars, the scientific understanding of evolution and the big bang, and the actual history of earth?

Could it be... *Gasp* Christianity?

[ February 17, 2002: Message edited by: Technos ]</p>

Technos

So are Humanist in many ways. Of course the individual rights of a human come first, which is why communism is rarely deemed humanistic as it restricts personal freedom.


Nor do I, communism has been tried by more than one culture and religion, it doesn't work. Any government that restricts individual rights and uses forced labor is bound to fail.


I agree, it is the same reason ethnic cleansing is almost always bound to fail, and when it does succeed those who were behind it are always remembered by history as monsters and rightly so.

Very few Atheist are fond of Communism, especially in formerly communist countries. I dare anyone to stand up before a group of people in a German marketplace and openly support communism, of course your body may never be found...

Datheron

Farseeker,

What "human reasoning"? Your theories are so lop-sided that they resemble a one-man titter-totter; how exactly is it that while I'm an atheist as much as the Chinese communists, I do not make the same conclusions, given your charge that it is indeed atheism and the freedom of thought and morally that drives this?

On the other hand, how do you stand to my charge that given the set of Christian denominations in the US alone, thousands of different sets of ideologies exist based on one book?

...this is precisely why I chose my words carefully, and you just had to try to impose the charge of hypocrisy, hm?

I specifically said "catalyst" because that's what religion did when talking about "religious atrocities". That is, without religion, it would have been much harder to accomplish what had been done. Case in point: if the peasants did not already have their absolute faith in the corrupt clergy, the Crusades would not have occurred in such swiftness, and (as I recall) definitely not 9 times.

On the other hand, we know that "atheist atrocities" really have little in terms of catalysts. You claim that "their own reasoning" is what brought about them about, but it's obvious from similar atrocities committed by religious figures and leaders that corruption makes more sense as the culprit, and not some weak claim on immorality.

FarSeeker

I stand corrected. I does indeed translate more accurately as "thou shalt not murder." Sorry for the misstating the case. God gives people the right to defend themselves I believe.

Hitler claimed to be a Christian? Where, I challenge you to give sources where he claimed that!

How were his actions in accord with the OT? Every Apostle was a Jew. Luke is the only writer I know of in the Bible who wasn't a Jew. Jesus died because of the sin of humanity, Jesus could have avoided his death even without the use of supernatural help by simply running away. The Jews were dispersed throughout europe, politically and socially weak, if God really wanted them dead, they wouldn't be here.

In fact, that argument has actually been used as evidence FOR the existence of the God of Abraham.

And Atheists have said destroying Christians is reasonable work. <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" /> <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" />

Triple Six

Destroying the lies that make up christianity is very reasonable work.

There is no atheist text book that advocates killing theists. As for communism I'm sure you will be able to quote me passages from the communist manifesto proclaiming genocide so we can then compare them with your biblical ones.

If you can't we have one system that has been perverted to justify mass murder (communism) and one system where the killers can be said to be merely following written instructions (guess which )