Consequent Infidel

whats the deal <flame del - liv>? are you getting too mad of me because i exposed your ass in that other thread that you'll begin stalking me in every thread?

River

I am wearing clothes . You are the one that is naked exposing your arse to the world.

livius drusus

The barroom tone this thread has taken is not acceptable. Sphinx, Mary's promiscuity, whether it be of a professional or strictly amateur bent, is not the topic of this thread. Calling her a whore is needlessly inflammatory and at this point more than a little boring.

River, if this topic is too insulting to your belief system for you to engage in reasoned debate without descending to all-caps rants or insults, then perhaps you should avoid it. Consequent Infidel, no more name-calling, please. If y'all choose to continue to participate, please comply with the rules and policies of IIDB and refrain from jerklike behaviors.

I remind the assembled that the matter at hand is how do modern Islamic scholars justify Mohammed's marriage to a child. Comparative analyses of justifications for the immoral sexual behaviors of other important religious figures are also fair game, but keep it clean, please.

Thank you,
livius drusus
Moderator - GRD

hinduwoman

I am afraid claiming that Muhammad married only old ladies and not for sensual pleasures is only apologetics, leaving out the circumstances of his many affairs.
Sahi Hadiths state clearly that Ayesha was 6 years old when she was married and 9 when the marriage was consummated. Saudah Bint. Zama whom Muhammad married at about the same time was 50, gave her 'nights' to Ayesha. Many modern Muslims insist that she was really 14-15 years old, but one website is very firm on this regard: Hafsah Bint Umar was 20 and Muhammad 56.
Zainab Bint Jahsh was the wife of Muhammad's adopted son Zayed. One day Muhammad saw her bathing and fell in lust with her. Right on cue Allah revealed that the previous Arabic custom of adopting sons is wrong and therefore Muhammad could marry Zainab without committing incest with daughter-in-law.
Safiyah Bint Huyay --- she was Jewish. Her tribe was defeated in battle, her father and husband slain by Muslims. She was taken captive by a soldier as his booty. But when Muhammad heard of her beauty he took her from the soldier . She was 17 and Muhammad 60 when they were married.

Muhammad was not quiet as above sex as the apologists would have us believe. Incidentally being embarrassed about Mohammed's sexlife is a modern trend. So we end up by having Quran only Muslims who insist that Hadiths are corrupted. The problem is without the background provided by Hadis many of the verses do not make proper sense:

Q. 66: 1-5.
1. O Prophet! Why do you ban that which Allâh has made lawful to you, seeking to please your wives? And Allâh is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.
2. Allâh has already ordained for you , the dissolution of your oaths. And Allâh is your Lord and He is the All-Knower, the All-Wise.
3. And when the Prophet (SAW) disclosed a matter in confidence to one of his wives so when she told it , and Allâh made it known to him, he informed part thereof and left a part. Then when he told her thereof, she said: "Who told you this?" He said: "The All-Knower, the All-Aware (Allâh) has told me".
4. “If ye two turn in repentance to Him, your hearts are indeed so inclined; But if ye back up each other against him, truly Allah is his Protector, and Gabriel, and (every) righteous one among those who believe,- and furthermore, the angels - will back (him) up.”
5. It may be if he divorced you (all) that his Lord will give him instead of you, wives better than you, Muslims believers, obedient to Allâh, turning to Allâh in repentance, worshipping Allâh sincerely, fasting or emigrants (for Allâh's sake), previously married and virgins. “

The Hadiths explain that Muhammad promised Hafsa not to have sex with her slavegirl Miriyam. But he did so. Hafsa came home early to find her husband in bed with her maid. Hafsa revealed this to Aisha and both were very rude to him. So Allah came to his rescue. The first two verses are reference to this oath by Muhammad: he had the right to enjoy a slavegirl and he need not keep oaths. The later verses scold the two wives for being rude and threaten them with replacement by more dutiful wives given to him by Allah. In fact Allah was so angry that he threatened to have Muhmmad divorce all his wives for better models.

Bumble Bee Tuna

Well, I was only playing Devil's Advocate, since the actual muslims on this topic seemed incapable of defending themselves and I wanted to inspire someone to post in detail about Muhammed's sex life to prove my post wrong. It worked. Thanks.

-B

sphinx wui

Moderator wrote,

Sphinx, Mary's promiscuity, whether it be of a professional or strictly amateur bent, is not the topic of this thread. Calling her a whore is needlessly inflammatory and at this point more than a little boring.


OK mod, I made my point already and I don’t need vulgarity anymore, I just used it in my preemptive strike and I think also calling Mohamed a son of a whore as my brother in atheism! emotional said is inflammatory and not related to the topic and I clarified the historic aspect of the subject!

To Magus, Rational BAC and Darthe Dave

I know how it is painful for a Christian to read words like condoms, anal sex, blowjobs, spread her legs, horney and whore in association with the mother of the living god! And I did it before life and I know all the clinical picture of exposing a Christian to such thing like congested pulsating neck veins, red ears, 3rd heart sound becomes audible with some extrasystoles, muscle twitches and some develop hysterical tics, don’t worry if you develop any of those symptoms, it is a self limited condition but avoid at any coast possible exposing yourself to Pat Robertson or Jerry Falwell when they attack Mohamed cause if such thing happens, my words will buzz in your ear again and you will get the same unpleasant experience, so be careful.


Darth Dave,

I am not agitated at all, I am just fine and actually having fun so don’t worry about my emotional status. The only person who can agitate me is my dear friend Loren Pechtel in the political forum.




Speaking seriously, I want to explain my position and make a comparison between Mohamed and Jesus to clarify my POV about both of them after removing any metaphysical dimension and dealing with them as historical figures.

Starting with Jesus -and for the sake of argument I will by pass the doubt about his existence- can you imagine yourself for a moment that you are a son of a single mother 2000 years ago in the ME? I can tell with confidence that everybody in his community was mocking him and his mother and alienate them as outcaste and this alienation made him an introvert with tendency to stay in isolated places (like staying forty days in the wilderness to be tested by Satan!) to avoid the humiliation and his harsh reality and this led to his ultimate delusion by declaring himself son of a father in heaven to compensate for lack of an earthly one.
He never had a career or stable job, he was thirty years old and never had a relation with a woman which was very strange by the norms of those days and it is quite destructive psychologically.

I can imagine him actually as “the village idiot” this character is famous in many Egyptian villages, mostly he is a guy with unknown origins and low IQ, has no job or woman, associate himself mostly with kids and telling them strange stories and sometimes they give him food or throw stones at him according to the kid!,uses strange vocabulary full of religious references, lives on charity from local people and wonder among the surrounding villages and disappear or die in an accident or strange way and the funny thing about this character that after his death, people start to think of him as a saint and they build shrines to honor him and I think that what happened for Jesus, there was no success story in his life, he got arrested, humiliated and killed not to pay for our sins but he was worthless person in a brutal primitive society and has nobody to defend him and a person like this can be killed in a society like that for simple reasons or no reason at all. After his death he became the victim that people like to sympathize with ( the same thing happened in Islam with Shia Muslims, Hussein became this bigger than life figure after he got killed in Karballa) and this is how the cult of Jesus started. After his death what Christianity achieved? For centuries they did nothing until they succeeded to hijack the Roman Empire and they brought it down and Europe was kept in the clutches of this cult until it rebelled against it, started the renaissance and issued the death certificate of Christianity.

Now, let us have a look at Mohamed, my position from him is very similar to the position of Americans from their founding fathers.

Mohamed’s life details- in contrary to Jesus- was better documented, he was from a well-known family in Mecca and personally he was known between his people by his good manner and behavior. He had a successful career as a businessman and he married at 25.he used to distant himself from the social life of Arab pagans in Mecca, he never drank alcohol or prostrated to an idol and he wasn’t comfortable with their practices.the Meccan community back then was a Darwinian society by all measures, the majority were pagans with Christian and Jewish minorities and to give you a clue what kind of society it was, one of the social norms was that if you got a female baby you can bury her a life and no questions asked “female infanticide” and based on this fact you can imagine the moral standards of such a society. Mohamed as a revolutionary and reformer stood up to his fellow Meccans and this was when the conflict of interests started. The Meccans felt threatened by the new ideas of equality and social justice and started to attack him verbally first and in an act of creative imagination, he made up all this thing about the one true god for all people as a sign of unity and the Quran and it was a bold move on his part to claim a divine support for his cause. Things went bad between the two camps and Mohamed preferred to move to another city after the Meccans tried to assassinate him (genius strategic move from him) and he started his social experience in a friendly place.
Mohamed in his new community succeeded to unify people around him and stop all the tribal fighting between the different tribes over there and he became a statesman, commander in chief beside his role as a prophet. The Meccans not satisfied with this end launched many attacks against the new community and were about to annihilate it in the “trench battle” cause the Jewish tribe that signed with him a pact to defend the city against the invaders betrayed him during the battle and made a secret deal with the Meccans to enable them to enter the city from the front they are defending.by the end of the battle he turned his army against the Jews and realized that the only road to peace is by conquering Mecca itself which he did few years later and after he entered Mecca without bloodshed he gave amnesty to all Meccans to open a new page in history of Islam and to die few years later.

Mohamed, by any standard was a huge success, he transformed bunch of alcoholic bastards to world leaders, he built an Empire from a scratch and above all he was completely human, he had a career, family and kids, fought in wars, made treaties with his enemies, laughed, cried, had sex, enjoyed it (who doesn’t!), spoke about it, ate meals and went to the rest room (the thing that the catholic church doesn’t want to admit to this day about Jesus!)

You can’t judge historical figures by taking them out of their time frame and judge them by the modern standards. If you do this with Jesus he will land in jail for asking a guy to steal a donkey or he will be banned from practicing medicine forever if he tells a patient asking for his help to treat her daughter that she is a dog!!!

About Mohamed’s marriage from Aisha, by modern standards it is wrong but putting it in its time frame it was socially accepted as it was with Mary. Girls living in hot areas reach puberty earlier than girls in cold areas and back then there was no schools or universities girls could go to and marriage for girls was the ultimate goal and it wasn’t a law that Muslims have to marry 9 years old girls, the minimum age for marriage now in Egypt I think is 16 or older I am not sure but things do change with time. Aisha after Mohamed died became a very important source of hadith for Muslims and became a central figure in Islamic history with a role no woman before her got in Christianity or Judaism even Mary herself was just a mother of Jesus.


Mohamed used marriage as a political tool to tighten ties with different tribes and lessen the animosity towards him. To give you a modern day example; regarding the issue of white/black in America. If GWB declared that he will gona to marry Condoliza Rice or another black woman, what will be the feelings of African Americans towards some thing like this? An action like this can kill in a second centuries of hate and prejudice between whites and blacks, it will make the black people feel that the president himself became one of them and has the desire to have kids from a woman belongs to them and will help the integration of the society and heal the psychological wounds of the past. Mohamed fought with the Jews and after he won the day he married a Jewish woman as an indirect message to the Jews that the war was over and nothing was personal against the Jews as a group and he married an Egyptian Christian “Maria the copt” and to this day Egyptians relate themselves to Mohamed through here. You blame him cause he was genius and know how to reach to people’s hearts? This was better or to shed oceans of blood in endless tribal wars?

Lastly Mohamed was a fan of female body (who doesn’t?) and he stated that the most two things he loved in this world were perfumes and women. He was honest with himself and acted as a human being. He never referred to sex as dirty or sin and in many occasions he spoke frankly about the art of fore play in his speeches. On the other side we can find the catholic church speak the whole day about celibacy and marriage to the church – whatever the heck is that mean- but behind closed doors the truth is disgusting, how you can deprive a man or a woman from a basic emotional and biological need and you expect them to be normal? Historically also, Mohamed wasn’t the only play boy and if you look at the OT you will find many of the characters there like David and Solomon had hundreds of wives (I wish I was there!)



Consequent Infidel wrote,

what the hell is a "muslim culturally" ?? you'r either a muslim or you'r not.

What the hell you are speaking about? Which language you speak? if you are living in Cairo, who built it? What you say when you meet people in Egypt, how you great them and from whom you got it? What you studied about Egyptian history in the last 1400 years, Mickey Mouse? What is your day off in Egypt? What are the feast days in Egypt? What is the most common name in Egypt? You never played soccer in street series in Ramadan after decorating your street with colored pulps and cartoon mosques? What is the nickname of Cairo? Have you ever heard of Salah Eldin and visited his castle? Have you ever-visited Islamic Cairo and have a diner in Alhussein square?

If I don’t believe now in the metaphysical aspect of Islam, is this mean to you that I become Columbian or Russian! Islam became the main factor in shaping Egypt like it or not but this is the truth.

I read in one of your “intellectual posts” that you made “an extensive research” about religion to discover the fallacies of Islam, honey it doesn’t need a rocket scientist to understand that all those religious books are bogus, all it needs is a 6 years old kid with common sense to reach to this conclusion. When a book tells you that an ant spoke with her fellow ant or a snake spoke with a woman or an ass spoke with a man, it doesn’t need extensive research Mr. Einstein.


BTW, would you please enlighten me about what you mean by Barsoom" rules and I will be more than happy to hear your opinion about Christianity and the bible.




Omar

sphinx wui

Hindouwoman,

Muslim scholars since the early days of Islam wrote many books criticizing Christianity and engaged with many Christian theologians in religious dialogues and left behind them a huge library regarding this subject and even some of them were from India but I never heard of a Muslim scholar criticized Hinduism or mentioned it in any way cause they considered it unworthy to even discuss cause it is a waste of time but I have to break this rule with you now as an exception.

Regarding the treatment of women and Mohamed’s marriage from Aisha, can you enlighten us please about how your wonderful cult handled situations like that, never mind, I will do it for you.


http://dalitstan.org/books/gowh/gowh7.html

Rama treated women with all the severity of the Vedas. As per standard versions of the Ramayana, Rama was 16 years old when she married Sita, and Sita was only 14 years old [ Ram.wh 69 ]. However, these are later, forged versions where the Brahmins have deliberately deleted incriminating passages proving that Rama married Sita when she was 6 years old. As per the oldest extant versions of the Ramayana, namely the Buddhist Ramayana, the marriage was performed as per Manu-Smrti, and Sita was only 6 years old when the lecherous bastard Rama raped her. Marrying a 6 year old baby clearly shows that Ram was not only a rapist and scoundrel to boot but also a child molester.



http://dalitstan.org/books/gowh/gowh-i.html

At the time I write this book, in June 1999, the status of women in India has sunk to its lowest ebb. After 50 years of Independance, cases of female infanticide, sati, dowry-related murders and crimes against women are on the increase, and in many cases are at their highest levels seen since the birth of the Indian Republic.




Real Reason for Oppression of Indian Women
Everyone has heard the Brahmin male propaganda that the customs of sati, dowry, female infanticide and all other social suppression of women in India is the result of `social degeneration', `coruption', or still worse, `foreign Christian or Muslim influence'. This is all one big lie designed to fool women. The reasons are far more deep-rooted, and are fully the result of Brahmin male conspiracies.

The real reason for the sad state of Indian women is the continuation of the Vedic and Vaishnava religions, collectively referred to as Brahminism or `astika' Hinduism. These religions clearly and unambiguously justify and prescribe the crushing of women to the status of sub-humans. Rather than being due to some kind of `corruption', the ghastly practices of sati, female infanticide, dowry and related acts are actually enforced by Vedic and Hindu scriptures. Although this may sound like some Christian or Muslim propaganda, it is not. I have backed up my research with quotations from Vedic and Vaishnava scriptures, and have shown that these religions, and nothing else, are the main culprits behind the most anti-woman system the world has ever seen. Far from being `enlightened' and `progressive', Brahmanism is in fact the very fountain of the evils of sati, female infanticide, devadasism and dowry.






http://dalitstan.org/books/gowh/gowh6.html

INCEST IN HINDUISM : HINDU ABUSE OF WOMEN
In order to permanently destroy the genetic stock of the non-Brahmin races the Brahmins enforced the depravities of child-marriage and incest upon the non-Brahmins. These customs led to genetic defects and mutations in the offspring as a result of consanginuity. Hence, incest is more common in Aryan Hindu society than in any other part of the world. References to this practice in ancient Indian literature abound. Often the girls were unwilling, but were then forced by their brothers/fathers to submit to the lecherous desires of the fanatic Aryan Hindu male. The strict Hindu, Buddhist and Jain emphasis on ascetism also played a role in the spread of this Hindu perversion. The main reason, however, was Brahmin imperialism. In addition to permanently degrading the genes of the non-Brahmins, this practice permitted the lecherous Brahmins to rape their daughters and hence help satiate their tremendous sexual apetite.
References to incest abound even in the Rg Veda, showing that the perversion of brother-sister incest was introduced by the Aryan savages who invaded India :
· `Lord' Krishna lived in incest with his sister Subhadra, sharing her with his brother Balarama [ Mah.wh.153 ]. "In the festivals of that God [ Jagannath ], the 3 images of Krishna, his brother Balarama, and his sister Subhadra, are brought prominently forward; and the populace do not fail to heap reproaches upon Krishna, and upon his sister likewise, for having indulged in a criminal intimacy" [ Mah.wh 153 ]. Again,
" In the older tradition, Subhadra [ Krishna's sister ] is said to have lived in criminal intimacy with both her brothers. This tradition is universally known and believed by the people in spite of the story of the marriage of Subhadra [ to Arjun ]; and the Mussalmans frequently taunt the Hindus with the fact. The Pundits reconcile the stories by a fiction of there having been two Subhadras. As to Krishna's proceedings, they are expalined away as Maya, or delusion."
-- [ Mah.wh.153 ]
· The Vedic Pushan is the lover of his sister [ Rg Ved VI.55.4 ] [ Apte 11 ]. No wonder so many Hindus have intercourse with their sisters !
· The Aryan God Agni is the lover of his own sister [ Rg Ved X.3.3 ] [ Apte 11 ]. A true model for all Aryans !
· Ashvins are referred to as the sons of Savitar and Ushas who are brother and sister [ Apte 11 ]. No doubt many pious Arya Hindus are the offspring of siblings.
· The Ashvisns married Surya and Savitri who is their sister [ RV I.116.19 ].
· Agni is the son of his father and his sister [ Rg Ved.I.91.7 ]
· Yama wards off his sister Yami, saying marriage between brother and sister is forbidden [ Rg.V.X.10 ] [ Apte 11 ]. This is the first indication that the Aryans had at least some moral sense ! However, this verse is evidently a later interpolation.
Father-daughter incest occurs in the famous story of Prajapati (later identified with Brahma, in turn incorporated as an incarnation of Vishnu) and his daughter [ RV III.31.1-2 ]. Moreover, this act was punished. Prajapati is thought to have done something wrong, and Prajapati was pierced by Agni as a punishment [ Sat.Br. XIII.9 ] [ Apte 63 ]. This shows that a slight sense of wrongness of the deed did exist amongst the Aryan savages. However, it was, and still remains, a widely prevalent practice in Hindu society. The punishments meted out to the incestous gods are of little consequence and are probably later Brahmin fabrications designed to wash away the embarassing episodes.
It is evident that the strict laws on male-female relations led to the repression of normal practies and played a role in the rise of various perversions like brother-sister incest, father-daughter incest etc. Strict ascetism always leads to the rise of perversions. Even to this day incest of varying degrees (cross-cousin, father-daughter, mother-son, brother-sister, etc.) is extremely common amongst the Indo-Aryans. No other race on earth has ever recorded such a prevalance of this practice. Just as sodomy has its home in Persia, Lesbianism in ancient Lesbos, so incest has its home amongst the Indo-Aryans.

6.5 LIBERATION OF WOMEN UNDER ISLAM, Contrary to Brahmin fanatic propaganda, Islam acted as a liberating force for women. The custom of seclusion of women in Islam was far milder than that practiced by the pre-Islamic Hindus and Persians :
`In Persia also seclusion of women was common before the Christian era.'
-- [MPS p.87]
Moreover, Mughal caliphs abolished the custom of sati.


http://dalitstan.org/books/gowh/gowh1.html

Atharva Veda.6.2.3 : " Let a female child be born somewhere else; here, let a male child be born."
-- [ Ath.Ved.VI.2.3 ] [ cf. Peri ]

Taittirya Samhita VI.5.10.3 : " Hence they [ Aryans ] reject a female child when born, and take up a male."
< Sans. " Tasmat striyam jatam parasyanti ut pumamsam haranti " >
-- [ Taitt.Samh.VI.5.10.3 ] [ Muir I 26 ]
In the neo-Brahminist Government of India, the genocide of women continues at full pace. Fully one-tenth of each generation of females is exterminated due to Hindu laws. Indeed, during the first 50 years of Independance, more than 50 million girls have been killed in India [ Verma ].
1.5 NEO-BRAHMANIST FEMALE INFANTICIDE
Following the bloody Aryan conquest of the Sudric nations of South India, the Aryan Brahmins utilised every conceivable means in order to eat away at the very backbone of the Dravidian race. Horrible practices like hijrahism, sati, enforcement of Vedic apartheid, Vedic human sacrifice (purushamedha) and female infanticide were used to oppress the native Dravidoids. The instilling of hatred against women in the masses was the direct result of the enforcement of the Aryan Vaishnava religion upon the Shaiva masses. The genocide of girls was institutionalised by the cunning Brahmins among certain sections of the Tamil population, whence this cancer spread throughout the veins of the Dravidian race. The following quotation refers to the survival of Brahmin-inflicted female infantcide amongst the Kallar clan of Dravidians :
" For a long time in a small hamlet, "Usilampatti", of the Madurai District of Tamil Nadu, India, a tribe called "Kallar" has dominated. "Kallar" means robbers, pirates, marauders, as they were in the past. There was even a Dept. in the local government called The Kallar Reclamation Dept., which was designed to reeducate them, as a backward "class". But their numbers spread in Southern District's of Tamil Nadu. A common feature is the practice of female infanticide. They tolerate a first born female baby, but not a second, because they cannot afford it. Both men and women agree that due to economic deprivation and social conditions, and having to marry girls means giving a dowry and jewels plus incurring the expenses of the marriage feasts, it is impossible to bring up a girl baby. Until girls mature they can be of some help at home or help producing food. However, leaving an unmarried adult woman at home is dangerous, and the work place is also considered unsafe. Therefore they poison the female babies soon after birth with a poison mixed with milk, or a milk-like juice from a shrub - madder juice, and the babies die due to nausea and diarrhoea. If they do not kill them, they may simply abandon the baby at a government hospital after giving a fictional address. "
[ Kurian ]
The origin of these practices can be clearly attributed to Brahminist brain-washing :
" The Kallar were once a proud warrior tribe, but under British rule were relegated to the status of mere thieves and forced to report daily to British officials... There is widespread belief that if a girl is killed then the next baby will be a boy and if two girls are killed consecutively then the next baby will definitely be a boy. Some people name their girls Vendam which means 'unwanted' or Podum meaning enough."
-- [ Kidd ]

http://dalitstan.org/books/gowh/gowh2.html
.1 BRIDE-BURNING
2.2 WIFE-BURNING
2.3 JAUHAR
Jauhar refers to the practice of the mass burning of all the wives and daughters in an entire town/district to prevent them from falling into the hands of enemies [ Nand, p.177-8 ].

2.4 WITCH-BURNING
2.5 SATI (WIDOW-BURNING)


http://dalitstan.org/books/gowh/gowh3.html
3.1 AMPUTATION OF WOMENS' EARS AND NOSES
3.2 HINDU WIVES PUBManu Smrti.VIII.371 : " If a wife, proud of the greatness of her relatives or (her own) excellence, violates the duty which she owes to her lord, the king shall cause her to be devoured by dogs in a place frequented by many."
Manu Smrti.VIII.372 : " Let him cause the male offender to be burnt on a red-hot iron bed; they shall put logs under it, (until) the sinner is burned (to death) ."
3.5 CANNIBALISM PRACTICED ON HINDU WOMEN
No other civilization degrades women to the extent that the truly animal Hinduism does


http://dalitstan.org/books/gowh/gowh4.html

4.1 STRIPPING OF FEMALE PROPERTY
4.2 DESTRUCTION OF INDEPENDANCE
4.3 MENTAL SUBJUGATION
4.4 RIGOROUS CHAPERONAGE
4.6 NO DIVORCE
All societies that grant basic human rights to women grant them the ability to divorce at least in the most severe cases of abuse or cruelty by the husband. Islam does so, as do many societies at the lowest rungs of civilization. Yet even this right to escape from the clutches of a monster is taken away in animal Hinduism. Divorce was not permitted, and women were forced to stay with their husbands, no matter how cruel or ruthless they were.
4.7 NO REMARRIAGE


http://dalitstan.org/books/gowh/gowh5.html

Sati - Brahmin Annihilation of Widows

I will complete it when I wake up, enjoy this now

if a bastard cursed me ...........this is a certificate that i am perfect

Arabic poem

Omar

hinduwoman

SphinxWu, actually going by your previous record I expected to charge in attacking Hinduism and you did!

Is it not amazing that while I had the courtsey of actually reading the Hadis and Koran (in order to see if what the detractors say is actually true) you did not, but relied on a site which though called dalitstan is for some mysterious reason run by Church of Texas? (Of course hearsay, but so hackers inform me). The very least you could have done was actually read Ramayana or Mahabharata at least.
Going to the source is always best.

If you feel calmer you can also go my webpage for info on hindu women:
http://www.hindunet.com/home/social_...oman/index.htm

or if you are interested in knowing how 'animal' hinduism actually exceeds rights given by your prophet to women go directly to:
http://www.hindunet.com/home/social_...uslimwomen.htm

You billed yourself as an atheist. But instead of defending Muslims as a people you defend the indefensible Muhammad whom the believers hold up as the perfect model for ALL ages. Then you attacked everyone who dared to criticize him.
If he had remined just an ordinary warlord who would have bothered? But he is not --- and muslims are enjoined to emulate him. That is why this is dangerous.


Islam is to be congratulated in its success at brainwashing.

hinduwoman

Cannot resist this:
The Brahmins changed the ages of Ram and Sita to make them more acceptable to their audience. The changes must taken taken place very early, since ancient literutre accepts those ages as the right ones, say at least 2000 years ago.
So this proves that the Hindu masses even 2000 years ago were morally superior to Muhammad and the Arabs.

EstherRose

Hi Sphinx wui,

I have a couple of questions. If the Koran states that you are only to have 4 wives, why did Mohammed break this and marry 12?

And if you fear that you shall not be able to deal justly with the orphangirls, then marry (other) women of your choice, two or three, or four but if you fear that you shall not be able to deal justly (with them), then only one or (the captives and the slaves) that your right hands possess. That is nearer to prevent you from doing injustice. (An-Nisa 4:3)

About Islam’s treatment of women. I seem to recall this sura as well.

Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allâh has made one of them to excel the other, and because they spend (to support them) from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient (to Allâh and to their husbands), and guard in the husband's absence what Allâh orders them to guard (e.g. their chastity, their husband's property, etc.). As to those women on whose part you see illconduct, admonish them (first), (next), refuse to share their beds, (and last) beat them (lightly, if it is useful), but if they return to obedience, seek not against them means (of annoyance). Surely, Allâh is Ever Most High, Most Great. (An-Nisa 4:34)b

And I seem to recall a nice hadith that explains how a woman’s witness is only worth half that of a man’s because of the deficiency of the woman’s mind.

Is this how muslims believe?

Glad I'm a Christian. My husband and I believe in what our bible tells us.

Ephesians 5
25Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her 26to make her holy, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word, 27and to present her to himself as a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless. 28In this same way, husbands ought to love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. 29After all, no one ever hated his own body, but he feeds and cares for it, just as Christ does the church-- 30for we are members of his body. 31"For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh." 32This is a profound mystery--but I am talking about Christ and the church. 33However, each one of you also must love his wife as he loves himself, and the wife must respect her husband.