Freethought & Rationalism Archive

tribalbeeyatch · 07-01-2003, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kinross
The government doesn't control money supply. In the US the federal reserve does. It is independent of the government and controlled by bankers.

I wouldn't say that it is *completely* independent of the government what with the Presidential appointments. This does give the government some measure of control over the Reserve.

Kinross · 07-01-2003, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tribalbeeyatch
I wouldn't say that it is *completely* independent of the government what with the Presidential appointments. This does give the government some measure of control over the Reserve.

How the Fed works

tribalbeeyatch · 07-01-2003, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kinross
How the Fed works

Errr....???

theyeti · 07-01-2003, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kinross
The government doesn't control money supply. In the US the federal reserve does. It is independent of the government and controlled by bankers.

The Fed does act like a semi-automomous beauracracy, it was created by an act of Congress in 1913. The government appoints the Fed Chariman and other members of the Reserve Board. It can control the money supply by virtue of controling the Board. It could also revoke the Fed's charter at any time if it fails to serve the public interest.

theyeti

lunachick · 07-01-2003, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kinross
No the great depression was caused by tightened fiscal policy during a cyclic recession. A global recession occured and governments responded buy raising interest rates, enacting protectionist trade policies, and raising taxes. Hardly what would be called libertarian policy.

Well, I'm no economist, but that's not what it says here.

Quote:

Calvin Coolidge's administration (and the conservative-controlled government) favored business, and as a result the wealthy who invested in these businesses. An example of legislation to this purpose is the Revenue Act of 1926, signed by President Coolidge on February 26, 1926, which reduced federal income and inheritance taxes dramatically. Andrew Mellon, Coolidge's Secretary of the Treasury, was the main force behind these and other tax cuts throughout the 1920's. In effect, he was able to lower federal taxes such that a man with a million-dollar annual income had his federal taxes reduced from $600,000 to $200,000. Even the Supreme Court played a role in expanding the gap between the socioeconomic classes. In the 1923 case Adkins v. Children's Hospital, the Supreme Court ruled minimum-wage legislation unconstitutional.

I appreciate that there were other factors involved, but that they were exacerbated by disparities between rich and poor, agricultural and industrial, too. It strikes me that libertarianism would also create a dangerous imbalance of wealth, causing an unstable economy. But as I said, I ain't no economist.

theyeti · 07-01-2003, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kinross
How the Fed works

From the site...

Quote:

The Federal Reserve System was established in 1913 when Congress passed the Federal Reserve Act. Although the Fed is independent of the government, it is ultimately accountable to Congress because Congress can amend the Federal Reserve Act at any time. Its actions, however, do not require any kind of approval from the government.
The Fed is called a "decentralized" central bank, which in itself seems to be a contradiction. It works, however, because the Fed is uniquely structured to eliminate government control but still remains accountable to both the government and the public. The Board represents the interests on the government side, and the regional Reserve Banks (whose boards of directors consist of local citizens) represent the interests of the private side. In order to operate independently of the government, the Fed finances its own operations.

The Board of Governors

The Fed has a seven-member Board of Governors and 12 regional Reserve Banks. The U.S. president appoints (and the Senate confirms) the seven Governors, whose 14-year terms are staggered to prevent a single president from being able to appoint too many governors. The chairman of the Federal Reserve, who serves a four-year term, is also appointed by the president.

Sounds like a government function to me. If you like the Fed the way it is, able to opperate semi-automonously, then that's great. I like it too. But many libertarians don't like it for the simple reason that it involves that horrible demon we call government.

theyeti

Kinross · 07-01-2003, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by lunachick
It strikes me that libertarianism would also create a dangerous imbalance of wealth, causing an unstable economy. But as I said, I ain't no economist.

Looking at NH there doesn't seem too be a great imbalance in wealth, has the least amount of people per capita below the poverty level, and has a very stable economy, weathered the recession very nicely.

I can't really dispute your authors claim but he doesn't seem well recognised, only published on a few personal web pages. Is he an economist?

Two books by ecomists on the great depression that I ran into are:
Essays on the Great Depression by Ben S. Bernanke
America's Great Depression by Murray N. Rothbard

Kinross · 07-01-2003, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by theyeti
Sounds like a government function to me. If you like the Fed the way it is, able to opperate semi-automonously, then that's great. I like it too. But many libertarians don't like it for the simple reason that it involves that horrible demon we call government.

theyeti

I like the federal reserve as well and think Greenspan has done a great job. I think it has the proper system of checks and balances and find it a necessary government function even though I don't consider it a government entity just accountable to it.

lunachick · 07-01-2003, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kinross
Is he an economist?

To be honest, I have no idea. This is all new to me. I've been looking for info regarding a thread I opened on the credit economy and it's sustainability, etc.

I still have a lot of learning to do.

That said, though - I more pinko-commie than libertarian, that's fo'sure!

As for the New Hampshire experiment; I'll just keep reading.

lunachick · 07-01-2003, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kinross
I like the federal reserve as well and think Greenspan has done a great job.

Speaking of Greenspan; Here's an editorial by someone who DOESN'T think Greenspan is doing such a fine job.

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