Pain Paien

Scigirl:

Since dk has decided to spread his nonsense into this thread (when he already has one dedicated to it), I suggest you add another reason to your list: insane conspiracy theories.

You see, "gay culture" causes perverted "gay mentors" to actively seek out "gay protégés", (budding adolescents boys) to whom they spread HIV, which corrupts their youthful minds, making them in turn spread the disease. Apparently, the homosexual movement wants to spread AIDS to the next generation, because homosexuality is a "pathological" affliction. Something like that.

scigirl

Hi Pain Paien,

Thanks for the suggestion! I'll keep it in mind. I would add it to the list tonight, but unfortunately I'm going out with some of my friends (some of whom are gay) to do our part to crumble american society and ruin family values. And here, all this time, I thought we were just going to have a drink or two.

scigirl.

Mediancat

Re the objection to "homophobe" and "homophobia": Simply objecting on the ground that the word SHOULDN'T mean that ain't kosher. If that were the case, the word "dispel" would be restricted to the breaking of spells and anyone who "testified" would be required to place their hands on their testicles. The word homophobia now DOES mean anti-homosexual bigotry. Whether it makes linguistic sense or not.

Rob aka Mediancat

Pain Paien

Yes, society today is such a fragile thing, it doesn't take much to crumble it. One question though, how will you ever know what's causing you to corrode society? It could be your gay acquaintances, your atheism, or the fact that you're female (Eve and all that business, technically you should just stay at home makin' babies, or else you'll be out tempting men to sin).

Sorry about this, I just find it so difficult to restrain myself. I'll try to derail your thread no further. I hope you have a good time destroying family values.

dk

lpetrich: dk:
First Christians have been the focus of government oppression from the beginning.
For not worshipping the official gods. Which ought to give pause to anyone fond of official "god" sloganeering. Or who sneers at atheism.
But guess what happened when one of the factions of Xtians got the support of the Roman Empire? It viciously persecuted the others out of existence. Consider what happened to the Gnostics and other sects.
dk: I read somewhere there are conservatively 20,000+ Christian sects, and clearly their have been unscrupulous people that subvert religious institutions to pursue secular ends. Arianism, Nestorian and Monophysite schisms have been a pox on Christian history. But science has also been subverted by secular powers. The schisms and wars that followed from Christian heresy, in my experience, reflect human frailties not Christian dogma. The 20th Century has been dominated by secular ideas, nations and politicians. The most progressive great nation-states all claimed to be founded on reason, science and purely secular values. Yet humanity fought three great world wars so brutal and bloody they stand peerless in the annals of recorded history. The first a war was fought to “end all wars” but lead to second conflict against fascism, that lead to a cold war to make the world safe for democracy. Even more revealing were the peace time atrocities committed by secular nations, for example the Armenian genocide, Soviet gulags, NAZI death camps, Chinese Great Leap Forward, Pol Pot’s Killing Fields,,, etc.. In an historical context science has lead secular powers and leaders to entertain and pursue death and destruction on an unprecedented scale, even death and destruction of a nation-state’s own people in times of peace. This doesn’t sound very scientific or reasonable of course, yet it happened and continues to happen. Today it seems quite reasonable, plausible and possible to postulate that the source of oppression, injustice and war follows human frailties, not religious institutions or science.

lpetrich: (lots of bragging about how poor-loving the Church allegedly is...)
However, the Church became rich and corrupt over the course of its long history, which provoked many rebellions agains it. All of them were ruthlessly suppressed, with only Protestantism surviving.
dk: Great Religions like nations and civilizations prosper and grow by solving problems that time presents. In my opinion Christian churches can be criticized for many things, but not their prosperity and grow. The riches you perceive don’t indicate corruption but prosperity that a rich cultural heritage secures. It is simply ludicrous to blame Christianity for the works of Michelangelo, de Vinci, and Raphael.

dk: Sadly the history has been lost on a modern secular public school system where secular politicians, judges, social engineers and educrats brag, “You can buy a better education America, but nowhere in the world does anyone pay more”?
What would dk do without such villains?
lpetrich: Villians? I didn’t say villains, I simply point the out the fruits of corruption, hypocrisy and decadence. In any sane world public education under the tutelage of the “New Left” and/or the “Great Society” has become an oxymoron. The costs of US public education outpace inflation, fiscal responsibility and common sense, and have done so for 40 years. Public Education has literally become a dumping ground for the social calamities an “omnipotent apparatus” won’t or can’t afford to acknowledge. It’s a laugher to blame Christian Churches for the ill conceived policies of secular… demagogues, clerics and opinion makers. Don’t even get me started!

lpetrich: And I note that dk never addressed the subject of homobigotry.
dk: Please note that scigirl also feels definitions a prerequisite to a fruitful discussion. I'd like to engage the discussion, but not by by slandering Christians. Scigirl needs to be more specific, for example “Christians that believe sodomy is an abomination on the sole basis of scripture are homobigots”, would do nicely. Scripture does say sodomy is an abomination, but I would argue there are many other reasons for a person to oppose the “Gay Rights Movement”. In fact lets not confuse the Gay Rights Movement with homosexuality, or other paraphilia like transsexuals, masochists, pedophiles,,, etc… I might oppose the Gay Rights Movement on the basis of Freudian egoism, Kinsey’s sexometer, Malthus’ Principle of Population, or pedagogical reasons. To label certain Christians from certain churches as one dimensional fanatics dehumanizes all Christians. Clearly Christians represent a diverse group of people whether they belong to the Moral Majority or not, so the definition scigirl gave needs a little work.

lpetrich: And I note that dk never addressed the subject of homobigotry.
dk: Hey, scigirl defines homobigots as “certain Christians”, so I am addressing the topic.

Overgrowngoblin

I'm an Agnostic male and love Christians. I have great empathy for Christian men that migrate to NYC, LA and SF to live in depraved, prurient, drug infested communities. I support all government programs that help Christian people who suffer disproportionately from HIV/AIDS/STDs, drug addiction, depression, violence and suicide, and anything else that can be done to help these poor people. However, I oppose the bigoted Christians because their political agenda undermines family values and recruits young protégés into the depraved lifestyle.

I always make sure to point them out to my son so he will always be wary and never forget the hatred and fear that some people possess. But until that thinking goes the way of the highway (as almost all terrible outdated ideas do) I have a rallying cry for you. It should do wonders to segregate those “gays” from your precious marriages: "Segregation now! Segregation tomorrow! Segregation forever!"

Give it a try. I’m sure you’ll get the reaction you deserve.

meritocrat

But there are no laws outlawing offence. Should there be?

Offence is wholly subjective anyhow. It wouldn't be possible to clamp down on all and any form of offence.

Apocolips

Hola!

I am very much against gay marriage, and homosexuality in general. The original poster (OP) placed some arguments on the table which seem rational, but are truly irrational, dangerous and stupid. Let's reveal the truth, shall we?

1.) Homosexuality is not natural. We, as human beings are of two sexes, not one. There are two sexes because it takes two to procreate. A man's sperm, and a woman's ovum or egg, coming together to make a child. This is the crux of natural.

Of course, many men and women do not have sex for the purpose of making a baby. Many of us use birth control. Some of us are sterile. Whatever. The male/female sexual relationship is biologically intended.

What gays do to each other is not natural, and it is not even sex. Sex can only occur between a man and a woman. Anal sex is not natural because the anus was not designed for having an erect penis inside of it. This is unnatural. If a man puts his penis in a woman, I would say the same thing. What Placing your mouth on another person's genitials for a pleasurable response is not sex either, what we call "oral sex" is really mutual masterbation. Bill Clinton told the truth when he said that he did not have sex with Monica Lewinsky because he did not. She merely masterbated him.

2.) Homosexuality is a choice and an addiction. We choose our sexual orientation. People are not born gay, alcoholic, or drug addicted. This is a choice that we have made during a period of our lives. Most gays choose this orientation after they reach puberty. The homosexual movement wants to perpetuate the lie that being gay is normal, and it is genetic, because the movement needs new people to replace the overwhelming amount of homosexuals who kill themselves or die from disease because of dangerous bodily practices, especially concerning the exchange of bodily fluids. There are very few gays who are senior citizens, but most heterosexual people live over 70.

3.) Men have a higher sex drive than women do. It is known that gay men have many multiple partners over a lifetime. The activity of "cruising" for anonymous sex is common and a widely accepted practice in the male gay community. Most lesbians I feel had some kind of trauma in their lives such as rape and molestation, and a fear of men, which has made them turn to other women for solace. Most gay women do not look like the gals in Hustler magazine or the internet either. Aileen Wournos is a better description.

4.) How many gays are overweight, drink and smoke too much and live depressed lives? I guess the OP is suggesting that most of us heterosexuals are fat, drunk, overeating slobs who smoke two packs a day, while gays are clean, well dressed, well heeled and sophisticated, when in fact that homosexuals have a higher rate of suicide, alcoholism and drug abuse than people at large.

5.) Gay "sex" is disgusting. It includes S/M, the eating of feces, the drinking of urine, placing foreign objects in the anal cavity for pleasure. As mentioned before, gays live far less time than heterosexual people do.

If gays have the right to be married, what is next? Marriage to children (pedophilia will be the next psycho-sexual revolution, and yes, male gays do molest the vast majority of children) marriage to animals, beastility, polygamy, what? If gays can become "married", the next thing is that they can adopt children, and I think that it would be a great sham that a child can be given to two mentally ill people (remember that homosexuality was classified as a mental illness until the 1970s).

Marriage is between a man and a woman only. Marriage involves two people of opposite sexes who commit to each other, mentally, spiritually and sexually. Gays cannot have sex as God and nature intends. People who are gay choose the lifestyle.

SENOR

mecca777

Are you confused? How can this shadowy gay movement "recruit" people if they're telling them that they have to be "born gay"? Any statistics on the "overwhelming" number of homosexuals who are dying in the manners you suggest, or are you just going to cite the well-known peer-reviewed publication "Everybody Knows"?
Wow. "You feel". Sure doesn't seem that way to me. Why would you pick a deranged and damaged murderer as representative of lesbians in general?
Because there are no straight people with unusual fetishistic sexual urges, right? Unless you just mean that they should be patriotic, and place home-grown objects in the anal cavity instead.
And? That classification has been superseded through a better understanding of the way that human sexuality and mind work. We don't call people with learning disabilities "defectives" anymore, either (or at least, I don't).

Thanks for dispelling the demons of irrationality, danger and stupidity, though.

Theli

oh, ok.

I do agree with the rest of the post, why should gay marriages be illegal? It's a victimless action, and it makes the people getting married happy, so where is the problem?
Sometimes I don't understand people's morality.
Take this nut for instance: The Ten Commandments: Against homosexualiy