blt to go

Donjared, I should not post a reply to this thread, being a fellow theist and being hopelessly outnumbered on this forum....

But, I must respectfully completely disagree with your position. I have found (in my short, short time here) that atheists are similiar to christians in that there are some I like, some I don't, some I could have a beer with, some I would choose to never converse with.

Just like any other segment of society, such as men, women, people from my city, etc. Some we like, some we don't.

As to being "angry," I will admit at first blush I felt that same reaction. But then I asked, "are these responses angry or abrubt?" In a few months I have seen the same statements, same responses from christians, and in fact, have been guilty of doing the same. I could see, after seeing the same thing over and over (atheists have no morals, atheists do no charity, atheists think they are god....) one could get tired of responding with full explanations for the thousandth time.

Although I do not necessarily see our society as "christian" I also understand that as a whole, there is alot about god, church and the "american way" that is intertwined. Imagine being a vast minority in a society that derides your belief (perhaps for a christian, the best example is being in a muslim society) Imagine knowing your belief is correct, and yet it would appear that all those around you are mocking you for your belief. Imagine trying to explain it on rational, coherent terms, and then hearing the response, "no, you are just wrong." Frankly, this would make ME frustrated and perhaps eventually angry.

Also, I view this as an atheist site. Imagine someone coming into your church, with a sixer, and throughout the service, downing a few cold ones. Most christians would be AGHAST at this blatant disregard for their decorum. (me, I would probably join them, but I do like beer. ) For a christian to come on here and start flaming away (regardless of the justification) I humbly find a breach of decorum. Call me "fundy" call me "xian" (call me "Ishmael") that is fine. no offense taken. Frankly, we christians can be a peculiar lot, why shouldn't we be made fun of? both by non-christians and christians alike. Want to see something painful? Review in the humor section, quotes of fundies. makes me cringe when I read it.

Finally, I would state that most (and by most I would say 95%) respond to my questions (despite perhaps being asked numerous times before) with politeness and genuiness. The other 5%? Ignore. There is too much to learn here to worry about the small percentage.

Disclaimer: I do not mean ALL atheists or ALL christians in any of the terms used above. Any portrayl of persons, whether real or imaginary is coincindental and not meant to portray said persons.

Matrioshka_Brain

Well, we bitch about radical Muslums, Scientologists, Objectivists or Librals (Depending on personal preference)...

But seriously, we also bitch about new agers, Dubya, ect. Haven't you been reading the boards? We discuss all kinds of things, and many of these discussions don't involve bitching. Just look at the Science and Skepticism boards - even this one.

___________________________________________
As to your questions about where human conscience comes from, you might want to look into:

"The Science of Good and Evil" - Michal Shermer
"The Selfish Gene" - Richard Dawkins
"The Moral Animal" - (?)

Good luck. I just attribute it to us being a social animal, evolutionarily. Perhaps some others can give recource suggestions?

Donjared

Whooee! I brought a firestorm down on me. A dash of flame really peaks interest no? Hey man, I don't know what the heck you guys believe. Every time one of you guys makes a claim, and I believe it, then another one of you comes along and says I'm assuming what you believe. I got my information from the articles that are provided here. I also have left feedback in the feedback forum from a couple of those articles I read. So whats the big whoop about making the claim? You guys ARE pissed off at the Church, just read this thread. I just wanted to know why and a few of the more serious and dispassionate types have given me that answer. Thank you.

As for my fellow Theist. Thanks for your experience and the advice. Truth be told, in person to person discussions I'm not quite so provocative. These guys can't see me smiling as I write, or as I read their responses. So I have long given up being fully understood on these forums. The best I can hope to do is rile someone up enough to want to waste their time writing me back. Some of their responses are coherent and educational, some are just the expected rants. I can cull through the baloney.
Also I certainly can understand their being bored and irritated with responding to the same old questions. I am the same way with regards to "the Church is corrupt and the Bible is inaccurate" schtick. Thats why I haven't responded to any of it here. I've heard that crap all my life, but particularly in college. For a while I made honest attempts to debate these charges with LITERALLY mountains of evidence to the contrary. I have a room full of Apologetical works by highly respected scholars (in the Christian community that is). But it dawned on me one day, that these guys just don't care. They have made up their minds. Their Atheism is just as faith based as my Theism, only I can admit that and they can't. We all believe what we want to believe, period. No amount of evidence for or against the existence of God is going to change any of us. So the beat goes on and on, since Christ walked the earth. If I (nor you) can convince them one way or the other, then honestly why should I give a hoot about offending them? Look at the things the say about the Father and the Son on some of these threads. And I should worry about offending them?
Oh yeah, and I like beer to! In fact I brew my own.
Like to spend more time but I am late for Church. Buh bye

DISSIDENT AGGRESSOR

I already knew the answer. I was hoping you would at least be honest to admit that you only do these so called acts of charity out of pure selfishness
to make your ego feel quite better about itself.

No, I won't ever not have a place to live or nothing to eat, so I believe there won't be any understanding to the "good" that is done.

Give someone a fish...

But hey! If it makes you feel good! :banghead:

BTW I added to my post as a joke. I'm not angry. Don't even hate the religious just self righteous people. Actually don't hate them, I'm not even an atheist. In order to be an atheist I would have to not believe in myself? That dosen't make sense :banghead:

I do feel that you are angry,though, by the comments you made to others who responded to your post, And telling me to contact my mothership? Is this all you've learned? I have never heard of a question being stupid.

KnightWhoSaysNi

I beg to differ. You may find this deconversion testimony quite interesting. He was a former evangelical missionary Bible translator who eventually became an agnostic. He posts here at II occassionally as 'Ken' by the way.

Yes, we're aware that there are people who have gone the opposite direction as well.

Jason

Calzaer

Why should he have to reinvent the wheel, when Confucius already explained that before Jesus was even born?

reprise

And I suspect that your church accepts donations from Christians and atheists alike. My all time favourite charity is Habitat for Humanity - a Christian organisation.

I live in a secular nation, but even us heathens quite happily donate to the Salvos and St Vinny's when they have their annual appeals - the good which is done by those organisations far outweighs any contempt I have for the odd branch which refuses to dispense its charity unless people jump through a series of religious hoops.

DISSIDENT AGGRESSOR

Wow!
You started this post wondering why Atheist are angry only to prove it's you're own inner anger at yourself and your self-doubt in your indoctrinated upbringing into a false realigion.

I see through you, my friend, if I can be so formal!

Seems you only came here to piss off people to begin with.
Well the first part of recovering from that screwed-up upbringing is to release that anger...
Hopefully you won't dissapear from this forum and find the truth you are obviously tryin' to find.
I've read your other post to variuos threads and if all you've shared [about your self] is true,hopefully we'alls can halp ya!
Pullease don't take this as slaggin' ya DJ, I'm not.
But if ya need help understanding your self-doubt we [or at least I am] are here to help!
What kinda of guns do you own/pefer when hunting!
I am a bow hunter myself

Singerian

Dude, I don't think playin mommy's gonna be enough. Usually it isn't. Yer probly gonna need to sort of "become" a Christian and be like the shoulder he can cry on and shit, and like the one thing in life he can rely on. Then, start screaming at the sky like your fighting God, and God's REALLY hurting you. Then he'll have to choose between your friendship and God.

He'll choose you b/c he knows way down deep that your real and God isn't. He'll feel clean and he'll be so glad your free cause he's grown to loves you. [off topic comments deleted]

cheetah

This thread seems to focus more on religion in general. Ergo, off to General Religious Discussions...

cheetah
MF&P mod